General Wolves News

[AndyWolves]

They are, but if a £3bn deal has been signed I would imagine there will be other opportunities to go along with that for clubs to exploit.

 

[Tony Towner]

Maybe, but as 5 PL teams are majority US owned including the biggest 2 then Wolves as an entity will be way behind. The deal is expected to be worth an extra £10m a year to each club and will provide greater exposure whoever wins the rights, but I don't see how this tie up assists in that. We could get a pre season game there, but that was going to happen in 2020 anyway.

You only need to see their current business interests to see its all about ESports, I wish Wolves would stop releasing info about it tbh. If you are interested there are other outlets like the specific ESports Twitter account to hear about it.

 

[Johnny75]

I suppose my considered opinion for all of this is that whatever benefits Fosun Sports group benefits the club, because the club is central to it all.

I think this is a very naive view. Fosun Sports Group clearly wants different revenue streams, the fact they are not under the club and rather all those revenue streams are separated would mean Fosun are spreading their risk and the only benefit of owning WWFC is the brand and that particular brand is already in the process of being delineated from football and into other markets.

It's the brand that has value not the football club and I really don't think Fosun give a shit about the performance of the club as long as it doesn't cost then money across the group. We are much the same as Thomas Cook for them.

 

[Tony Towner]

I think this is a very naive view. Fosun Sports Group clearly wants different revenue streams, the fact they are not under the club and rather all those revenue streams are separated would mean Fosun are spreading their risk and the only benefit of owning WWFC is the brand and that particular brand is already in the process of being delineated from football and into other markets.

It's the brand that has value not the football club and I really don't think Fosun give a shit about the performance of the club as long as it doesn't cost then money across the group. We are much the same as Thomas Cook for them.

Yep, this season is panning out perfectly for them. Will make a profit on the football side whilst not likely to flirt too much with relegation. As said before that strategy only works for so long though

 

[From Distant Shores]

I wouldn't have thought so. They have put a chap in at director level on the football side though

According to the local press: "Two new additions have also been made in the boardroom in advisory positions, with James Baboulas, PEAK6’s associate general counsel and member of PEAK6’s strategic capital team, set to serve on the supervisory board of Fosun Sports, and PEAK6 capital management trader John Makowiec becoming a director at Wolves."

I'm not actually sure what a capital management trader does but it sounds very much as though he would have been called a financial engineering expert last century. I find it hard to see him having any positive role to play and hope that it is a "trophy directorship" in return for handing over some cash to Fosun.

I suspect one reason for this corporate structure being put in place is the massive accumulated losses on Wolves balance sheet which will stop Wolves paying any dividends for a long time. It is clear that Fosun are trying to maximise their return on their investment in Wolves. I really hope that they will still see Wolves being a key part of Fosun Sports in ten years time.

 

[Donegal Wolf]

PEAK6 Investments acquire minority share in Fosun Sports

US finance and technology firm PEAK6 Investments has acquired a minority share in Fosun Sports, the holding entity that operates Wolves and its associat...

www.wolves.co.uk

No mention in that statement funnily enough about their 100% ownership of Dundalk, thought that they would be in Europe every year so make money on a small enough investment..

They have managed to raise the bar for bad owners in the LOI ( which believe me over the years has had some steller attempts) with some strange decisions. Took over a club in 2017 which in the previous 7 years, won the league 5 times and two runners up spots and in the Europa League group stages, now with a playing budget 4 times that of most of their rivals are in a relegation battle (although should be ok now) and with their relationship with the fans having a Mike Ashley/Newcastle vibe about it.

Less they have to do with the club the better.

 

[AndyWolves]

I think this is a very naive view. Fosun Sports Group clearly wants different revenue streams, the fact they are not under the club and rather all those revenue streams are separated would mean Fosun are spreading their risk and the only benefit of owning WWFC is the brand and that particular brand is already in the process of being delineated from football and into other markets.

It's the brand that has value not the football club and I really don't think Fosun give a shit about the performance of the club as long as it doesn't cost then money across the group. We are much the same as Thomas Cook for them.

Why wouldn't they separate the risk if they can? There's no point risking all the entities within Fosun group by putting them all under wolves.

And theye clearly going to generate revenue for Fosun because that's what they do. It would be naive to think Fosuns aim would be to generate income solely for Wolverhampton Wanderers benefit, we can hope that the club will benefit from successes made by other entities within the group and having a successful, high profile football club (as has been said many times) would only help the brand.

Maybe I phrased it badly, but I think Fosun sports group doing well is good for the club. I'd rather our club be part of a successful group than an unsuccessful one.

The pragmatic view I have is that for the club to be where we are now means we have to part of Fosun (and everything that goes along with it). The alternative is a very different place indeed, and not somewhere I want to go back to.

I've asked this question before, if all they wanted was a brand - why go to the ballache and expense of buying a football club? Why not simply create one? Why even take the risk of owning a football club?

 

[Tony Towner]

They've spent just over £170m. Newcastle were just sold for £305m. £128m of that is business loans, which you would presume over time will be paid back. That's why

 

[Alan]

I still don't get the sense that anything Fosun does around the edges of the club is worth getting all riled up about just yet.

They are an investment business that wants to grow their profit margins. I don't know why them doing anything that might line their coffers is a surprise. The money might not be going back into the club but it's not as if they're siphoning money away from the football side (that we know of, I suppose).

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Using our IP to make money for themselves would technically fall under that umbrella.

However it's worth fuck all, so not worth getting worked up about one way or the other. It doesn't mean we can afford extra new players above and beyond what we already could (we already aren't spending what's on the football club's P&L sheet). Like Tony I wish they'd stop pushing it, I don't give a fuck about eSports, nor does anyone else.

 

[Alan]

Using our IP to make money for themselves would technically fall under that umbrella.

However it's worth fuck all, so not worth getting worked up about one way or the other. It doesn't mean we can afford extra new players above and beyond what we already could (we already aren't spending what's on the football club's P&L sheet). Like Tony I wish they'd stop pushing it, I don't give a fuck about eSports, nor does anyone else.

This bit is patently untrue but your point is made.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Ok.

Insufficient numbers of people who actually watch Wolves give a fuck about eSports for them to be giving it the push that they are. I would estimate that <1% of people who engage with the club on any meaningful level care about that.

Even if they did care, we wouldn't make any money out of it.

 

[AndyWolves]

They've spent just over £170m. Newcastle were just sold for £305m. £128m of that is business loans, which you would presume over time will be paid back. That's why

If they're looking to flip why go to the hassle and cost of trying to create a wolves brand for other things.

Maybe they're looking to sell the whole group at some point as I can't see who you could sell the club with all the other bits still in place.

If they're only after the brand, there are cheaper ways than putting £128m into a football club.

If they're looking to flip the club why even bother with the "wolves brand" stuff given how long it'll take to pay back.

What interests me is the chappy coming onto the board of the wolves football club holding company. That suggests that the football club are going to be involved with Peak6 somehow.

I honestly don't get the hostility that these kinds of announcements bring about.

 

[AndyWolves]

Ok.

Insufficient numbers of people who actually watch Wolves give a fuck about eSports for them to be giving it the push that they are. I would estimate that <1% of people who engage with the club on any meaningful level care about that.

Even if they did care, we wouldn't make any money out of it.

It's the other way round, it's getting people who watch eSports interacting with the wolves brand.

I don't think today's announcement is purely about eSports, I think there are football club implications too.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

We have a very finite audience unless we start actually winning trophies, which we're unlikely to any time soon.

It's just white noise. It means nothing, we seem to be expending unnecessary effort on it.

 

[Alan]

It's the other way round, it's getting people who watch eSports interacting with the wolves brand.

I don't think today's announcement is purely about eSports, I think there are football club implications too.

I am hoping that this is how Fosun is looking at it.

 

[AndyWolves]

We have a very finite audience unless we start actually winning trophies, which we're unlikely to any time soon.

It's just white noise. It means nothing, we seem to be expending unnecessary effort on it.

I think it's about getting exposure to other markets outside of football, I.e. people who watch eSports etc

 

[Johnny75]

It's the other way round, it's getting people who watch eSports interacting with the wolves brand.

I don't think today's announcement is purely about eSports, I think there are football club implications too.

The bit you keep on missing is that the Wolves brand beyond to WWFC and Wolves eSports belongs to Fosun Sports.

Any interacting with the brand would be good for Fosun but would mean nothing to the club. The eSports fans aren't going to Molineux, probably know nothing about football and have no intention of buying merchandise through the club (the important bit).

I can't see how you can't understand that this is of no financial benefit for WWFC in any way shape or form.

 

[AndyWolves]

The bit you keep on missing is that the Wolves brand beyond to WWFC and Wolves eSports belongs to Fosun Sports.

Any interacting with the brand would be good for Fosun but would mean nothing to the club. The eSports fans aren't going to Molineux, probably know nothing about football and have no intention of buying merchandise through the club (the important bit).

I can't see how you can't understand that this is of no financial benefit for WWFC in any way shape or form.

Did I say there was?

I even said "wolves brand"

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

I suppose as part of their remit of increasing brand exposure in North America they could be tasked with finding a big American company wanting to pay a wad of cash to replace ManbetX. And presumably we will do US / Mexico pre season stuff, especially with Raul about. That’s the only potential significant upsides I can find.

Esports monetisation is going to really be pennies and it won’t go to us unless we have a licence agreement with Fosun group for the use of our IP in this fashion that sees us receive fees. I doubt that is in place as they will view it as infra-group usage.