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Thread: Jeremy Corbyn

  1. #1
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    Jeremy Corbyn

    A poll by youguv for The Times has said that Jeremy Corbyn is the favourite to become the next leader of the Labour party. Tony Blair clearly thinks it would be a mistake to elect Corbyn, but I wonder if the party will really go for such a left wing candidate. I must admit I expected Andy Burnham to be the next leader.

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    well the tories have a very right wing leadership, so would be very timely for labour to go left

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    41 years since anything other than a centre left Labour Party won a General Election, elect Corbyn and it'll be at least 51

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    The other day, a large group of Labour MP's defied Harriett Harman and voted against the welfare bill. Andy Burnham admitted they got themselves in a bit of a mess over the issue. There are clearly divisions within the party, but I do not see Corbyn as the man to unite them.

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    I would be delighted if Corbyn won. He's anti austerity and as far as I know, the only candidate to oppose the Tories welfare bill. The Labour Party are in danger of becoming a bit irrelevant if all they want to do is offer slightly fairer versions of what the Tories can offer (although I'd obviously rather have the Labour policies than the Tory ones). I didn't vote for them in the last election and the way they are heading at the moment, probably won't vote for them at the next election. Corbyn could get my vote back.
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    But wouldn't get the votes in middle and southern England that Labour need to form a Government. They may win back some of the Scottish seats. If Labour want to again be a socialist party then that is their prerogative but it would mean permanent opposition

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    That's Tony Blair's opinion. Doesn't make it right.

    I heard Harriet Harman express her opinion on Sunday Politics saying that she wasn't going to oppose the Conservative plans because she didn't want the public thinking that the Labour Party was going to oppose the Conservatives per se, and that they lost the last election on the Economy and Welfare and that the Labour party must not move to the left.

    This is why they are in disarray when half their MPs went into the division lobbies to vote against the Welfare Bill against the advice of Harman. Labour needs to decide who they want to represent and what principles they want to follow. Strong leadership is absolutely key to the party re-discovering their identity whatever it is going to be and not making assumptions based on media claptrap.

    Jeremy Corbyn would certainly pull Labour to the left of centre, but where is the centre at the moment? Andy Burnham voted against the Welfare Bill too. The situation regarding the Labour leadership has still a way to run whatever the media thinks.
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    As I said previously, the Labour Party needs to decide what it wants perpetual principled opposition or potential government, with Corbyn they are voting for the former and just like last time would have a leader that isn't the choice of the PLP which I appreciate is the way the party is structured but I'm not sure is productive.

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    strange frank not liking left wing jeremy corbyn whilst his party seems desperate to allow the chinese communists to build nuclear power stations in britain. no danger there eh?

    let's just hope we don't have any issues with them like we do with the russian "communists"
    it is not that I have no past. rather, it continually fragments on the terrible and vivid ephemera of now.

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    I don't understand why Corbyn is portrayed as dangerous by the media yet we currently live in a libertarian dystopia shaped by the likes of IDS, Gove, May and Gideon which is apparently just fine, even though that actively damages ordinary people's lives on a daily basis.

    I cannot support any version of the Labour Party which agrees with measures which condemn people to poverty just because y'know, cuts. Failing to oppose the Welfare Bill was utterly shameful.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deutsch Wolf View Post
    I don't understand why Corbyn is portrayed as dangerous by the media yet we currently live in a libertarian dystopia shaped by the likes of IDS, Gove, May and Gideon which is apparently just fine, even though that actively damages ordinary people's lives on a daily basis.

    I cannot support any version of the Labour Party which agrees with measures which condemn people to poverty just because y'know, cuts. Failing to oppose the Welfare Bill was utterly shameful.
    perhaps he doesn't cheat on his expenses enough for some people, so shows he's lacking in entrepreneurial spirit. how much was that breakfast IDS had again?
    it is not that I have no past. rather, it continually fragments on the terrible and vivid ephemera of now.

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    I quite like a lot of his political ideals, but he is unelectable. Big business would never allow such a radical left winger to get elected in the UK.
    It is a shame, but his age and image would make a big difference, too. The Labour party will only get elected, if they move to the centre and the Conservative party makes some monumental mistakes.
    I agree with many of Corbyn's political ideals, but he would never get elected, which is all that matters.

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    If MPs want to represent a party which firmly belongs to the centre right of politics and seeks to gain electoral territory from the Tories by slightly toning down their more rabid actions, then they should form a new one. Nothing stopping them doing that. It shouldn't be done in the Labour Party's name.

    I don't want a US style system where the differences between the main parties are so negligible as to barely matter. As Tredman says, just because the Tories are inevitably drifting further right it doesn't mean everyone else has to follow. Some of us would rather like an alternative.

    Quote Originally Posted by nimrod View Post
    perhaps he doesn't cheat on his expenses enough for some people, so shows he's lacking in entrepreneurial spirit. how much was that breakfast IDS had again?
    39, but he could definitely live on 53 a week if he had to, don't you know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deutsch Wolf View Post
    If MPs want to represent a party which firmly belongs to the centre right of politics and seeks to gain electoral territory from the Tories by slightly toning down their more rabid actions, then they should form a new one. Nothing stopping them doing that. It shouldn't be done in the Labour Party's name.

    I don't want a US style system where the differences between the main parties are so negligible as to barely matter. As Tredman says, just because the Tories are inevitably drifting further right it doesn't mean everyone else has to follow. Some of us would rather like an alternative.



    39, but he could definitely live on 53 a week if he had to, don't you know.

    Good post Deutsch!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deutsch Wolf View Post
    If MPs want to represent a party which firmly belongs to the centre right of politics and seeks to gain electoral territory from the Tories by slightly toning down their more rabid actions, then they should form a new one. Nothing stopping them doing that. It shouldn't be done in the Labour Party's name.

    I don't want a US style system where the differences between the main parties are so negligible as to barely matter. As Tredman says, just because the Tories are inevitably drifting further right it doesn't mean everyone else has to follow. Some of us would rather like an alternative.



    39, but he could definitely live on 53 a week if he had to, don't you know.

    is that picture taken after he heard what leon brittan "allegedly" liked to dress schoolboys in?

    how is the cover up investigation going? anyone know? i mean norman tebbit knew something didn't he? surely that's worth investigating?
    it is not that I have no past. rather, it continually fragments on the terrible and vivid ephemera of now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nimrod View Post
    strange frank not liking left wing jeremy corbyn whilst his party seems desperate to allow the chinese communists to build nuclear power stations in britain. no danger there eh?

    let's just hope we don't have any issues with them like we do with the russian "communists"
    To be fair, I did not say I do not like Jeremy Corbyn. My point is that I am not convinced that the Labour Party electing him as leader will not unite the party and in some eyes a throwback to the 1980's will not be a progressive movement for the party.

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    i saw an interview with him on C4 a week or so ago and he was shouting at Krishnan to be allowed to speak even though he wasn't answering any of the questions asked. It was very unprofessional and not what I expected at all.

    His ideals are too far left for me but compared to the others he has personality and the courage of his convictions. I wouldn't vote for him and I think the Party would be unelectable with him as leader but I admire him for taking a stand in what are pretty awful times for the Labour Party.
    Nothing to see here...... can't offend sensitive souls.

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    I hope the English media attack his policy rather than try and attack his personality.

    The thoughts of Jeremy Corbyn.

    Wealth creation is a good thing: we all want greater prosperity. But let us have a serious debate about how wealth is created.
    If you believe the Conservative myth then wealth creation is solely due to the dynamic risk-taking of private equity funds, entrepreneurs or billionaires bringing their investment to UK shores.
    So if we follow the Conservative’s tale then it is logical to cut taxes for the rich and big business, not to bother to invest in the workforce, and be intensely relaxed about the running down of public services.
    But in reality wealth creation is a collective process between workers, public investment and services, and, yes, often innovative and creative individuals

    Understanding this means getting to grips with the key choice in the leadership election and indeed the key choice facing Britain:
    Whether to accept austerity or whether to break free of this straitjacket and strike out for a modern, rebalanced economy based on growth and high quality jobs.
    Labour must create a balanced economy that ensures workers and government share fairly in the wealth creation process
    • that encourages and supports innovation in every sector of the economy;
    • that invests in skills and infrastructure to build an economy that is more that invests in skills and infrastructure to build an economy that is more sustainable and more equal.
    The purpose of this document is to set out some of the key parts of that vision.
    That includes not only the overall approach we must take to the economy as a whole, but some specific key changes on taxation

    https://d3n8a8pro7vhmx.cloudfront.ne...pdf?1437556345
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  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by thehistorymakers View Post
    I agree with many of Corbyn's political ideals, but he would never get elected, which is all that matters.
    This is the problem for me - winning shouldn't be everything in politics. Politics should be about debating ideas and policies. If you sacrifice your political beliefs in the pursuit of power you have a moral deficit straight away. It will surprise nobody that I will be voting for Jeremy Corbyn not because I think he can win but because I believe his political beliefs are more aligned with mine and I would want him to retain those beliefs and put them first to the Labour Party and then the electorate.
    No.

  20. #20
    [QUOTE=thehistorymakers;795909The Labour party will only get elected, if they move to the centre [/QUOTE]

    The Labour party needs someone like Corbyn just to move back to the bloody centre the shift has been so rightward.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Saturday Boy View Post
    This is the problem for me - winning shouldn't be everything in politics. Politics should be about debating ideas and policies. If you sacrifice your political beliefs in the pursuit of power you have a moral deficit straight away. It will surprise nobody that I will be voting for Jeremy Corbyn not because I think he can win but because I believe his political beliefs are more aligned with mine and I would want him to retain those beliefs and put them first to the Labour Party and then the electorate.
    Absolutely. Being in opposition isnt just about doing whatever it takes to get power. Its about challenging the narrative and working to persuade the electorate that you offer a better vision for the country. Not just 'Whatever you want we'll give it to you...'

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    Quote Originally Posted by Visage View Post
    Absolutely. Being in opposition isnt just about doing whatever it takes to get power. Its about challenging the narrative and working to persuade the electorate that you offer a better vision for the country. Not just 'Whatever you want we'll give it to you...'
    Quote Originally Posted by The Saturday Boy View Post
    This is the problem for me - winning shouldn't be everything in politics. Politics should be about debating ideas and policies. If you sacrifice your political beliefs in the pursuit of power you have a moral deficit straight away. It will surprise nobody that I will be voting for Jeremy Corbyn not because I think he can win but because I believe his political beliefs are more aligned with mine and I would want him to retain those beliefs and put them first to the Labour Party and then the electorate.
    Exactly right. By being a strong leader and an effective opposition you will be elected, esp. when the Govt. has only a slender majority and unpopular policies. Wait until the fiasco of the referendum is over and see what the electorate think then.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Visage View Post
    Absolutely. Being in opposition isnt just about doing whatever it takes to get power. Its about challenging the narrative and working to persuade the electorate that you offer a better vision for the country. Not just 'Whatever you want we'll give it to you...'
    Yes. This is why Harman got battered the other day telling Burnham they'd 'lost the argument' over public spending. Nobody in the Labour party made the fucking argument.
    "When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him." Jonathan Swift

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    Quote Originally Posted by Templeton Peck View Post
    Yes. This is why Harman got battered the other day telling Burnham they'd 'lost the argument' over public spending. Nobody in the Labour party made the fucking argument.
    Maybe to win the next election Labour should argue on their economic record rather than accepting the media/Tory view. Gideon will fuck up because he's basically incompetent and Labour should hammer him at every opportunity.
    In the age of information, ignorance is a choice.

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    The Labour Party need to stop the in fighting. Calling people morons, or saying they need heart transplants does them no favours. Today the arguments continued with Messrs Prescott and Milburn wading in. And the unions have also put their view across. The country needs a strong opposition, as weak opposition leads to complacent Government. We saw it after Blairs landslide win 1997. The Conservative party tore itself apart and had Michael Howard and Iain Duncan Smith as leaders. For eight years after the 1997 debacle, the Conservatives were not doing the job that her majesty's opposition should be doing. If Labour want to avoid being in similar dire straits they need to stop the in fighting, let the leadership contenders put their views across, and then get behind whoever wins.

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    The likes of Burnham, Cooper and Kendall have nothing to offer to me. I don't want to vote for a right wing politician.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Knows View Post
    Maybe to win the next election Labour should argue on their economic record rather than accepting the media/Tory view. Gideon will $#@! up because he's basically incompetent and Labour should hammer him at every opportunity.
    Corbyn would and already has been. The other three candidates have largely accepted the Tory narrative meaning defeat in 2020 unless the govt massively fuck up and people are desperate to vote them out.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deutsch Wolf View Post
    The likes of Burnham, Cooper and Kendall have nothing to offer to me. I don't want to vote for a right wing politician.
    Agreed. Its Corbyn or nothing for me. I can't vote for anyone who accepts the economic necessity for austerity.
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    Of course the Tory's are very clever. They included the minimum wage rise in the Welfare Bill, so even though it will put 1000's of families into more poverty, if Labour voted against it then Osbourne will say they voted against increasing the minimum wage.

    Such is politics.
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    Do you politically savvy types on here think there will be a swell in Green Party voters should one of the centre-right Tory apologists become Labour leader?
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