Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 70

Thread: V.A.R. - Good for Purpose??

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    St. Neots, Cambs.
    Posts
    7,610

    V.A.R. - Good for Purpose??

    There have been many comments on here about the VAR system and how it affects the game, for good or bad.

    "Premier League chairmen will next month review the policy on pitchside monitors following a rash of controversial VAR incidents including a debatable call to rule out a winner for Arsenal yesterday. (27th Oct.)

    There have been 100 Premier League matches so far this season and 26 overturned decisions but due to the existing policy there has not been a single incident where the referee has consulted the monitor himself. The top-flight clubs will meet in London in three weeks’ time when the issue will be discussed." (The Times)

    Whether this will improve anything remains to be seen but it is obviously a matter of concern for the clubs and an enigma for fans esp. those watching the game at the ground.
    'Our goal is crystal clear: we will do our very best to help take Wolves back to the Premier League as soon as possible, and to stay there.'(21st July 2016). *Promotion achieved 15th April 2018.** 2019-7th-57pts-Qualify Europa*

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Newport, Shropshire
    Posts
    2,444
    I've no issue with var itself but it needs to be quicker. The biggest problem for me is the operators get lots of decisions wrong at the end of it, can't believe its just incompetance, for most of the season they have just gone with the refs call when it was obviously wrong, then last weekend they over-reacted to criticism and gave some ridiculous penalties, they just need to grow a spine and give what they see and not worry about upsetting any of the authorities
    FJRWolf

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Bilbrook
    Posts
    86,647
    Three issues for me right now:

    1) Speed. I mean Man City's second goal vs Villa. You don't need 20 replays to make your call on whether Sterling is interfering with play or not, and that is the only question. Surely you either think he is or he isn't. Why all the delay?

    2) Communication inside the grounds, trust the fans FFS. Show the pictures, put the audio over the Tannoy (TM).

    3) Consistency - the biggest one. Let's have a look yesterday at United's penalty on James and our non-penalty on Doherty. You might decide that they're both penalties. You might decide that neither are, there isn't really enough in it. You can't have it where one is given and one isn't! This is supposed to give us definitive answers with the benefit of having multiple angles and extra time to have a look in slow motion, not give us another level of subjectivity.

    Fans do need to grow up a bit with it. It's no good flinging your arms around and having a tantrum, or indulging in genuinely mental conspiracy theories. It's here, it isn't going to go away. So the concerns need to be voiced sensibly, then perhaps the authorities will listen.
    The rain falls hard on a humdrum town.

    http://oscillatingwildly.net
    Twitter
    Facebook

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    13,046
    Thirty second review time then itís too late. That would rule out the slide rule calls and I can live with that. A howler is spotted within seconds. The ref then must review every case to see the evidence. Then they make the decision based on the evidence. Itís not hard. It is so not why we needed var
    Remember, remember we are doing OK this November .

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Cayman Islands
    Posts
    24,385
    They don't need to consult a monitor. There's two great big screens they could put it on.

    I have no idea why these people are in charge. They are the British Leyland of the 21st Century.
    Nothing to see here...... can't offend sensitive souls.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    1,206
    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny75 View Post
    They don't need to consult a monitor. There's two great big screens they could put it on.

    I have no idea why these people are in charge. They are the British Leyland of the 21st Century.
    The quality and quantity of the screens varies though. (United and Pool don't have them)

    The pitch side monitor would be fine by me. Having different refs potentially over ruling the pitch ref is causing the biggest problems.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Bilbrook
    Posts
    86,647
    Quote Originally Posted by Elephant Pyjamas View Post
    The quality and quantity of the screens varies though. (United and Pool don't have them)

    The pitch side monitor would be fine by me. Having different refs potentially over ruling the pitch ref is causing the biggest problems.
    Easy thing with our pen yesterday. "Kev, we've spotted a shirt pull in the box. We'd like you to have another look."

    Then he can make his decision. I wouldn't necessarily blame him for not seeing it in real time.

    Staggering that the Fernandez/Jota challenge wasn't even looked at.
    The rain falls hard on a humdrum town.

    http://oscillatingwildly.net
    Twitter
    Facebook

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Stafford
    Posts
    13,323
    I reckon they could afford a couple of screens. If they donít, relegate then.
    )

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    3,521
    Bin it altogether. It's ruining the game.
    'I never predict anything and I never will'......Paul Gascoigne.

  10. #10
    Kenny's Avatar
    Kenny is offline Post Sponsored by the creators of the Gallimore Scale
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    42,323
    Communication is the main one for me. We need to know in the ground what is happening. I also agree with suggestion of a time limit. If it can't be decided in 30 seconds then it's not clear and obvious and you stick with the original decision.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Northallerton
    Posts
    2,295
    Sadly VAR will not be sent back to the fetid pool of "ideas to ruin football" it came from (also featuring Golden/Silver goal and the current handball rule).

    The VAR official should be allowed 1 view (from each angle) in real time. If there is nothing obvious then the ruling stands. There's no value in ruling about Sterling's big toe being offside but you won't see that in real time, however you would see Bertrand mashing Perez.

    After that, leave the faux outrage and slow motion replays to Carragher and Neville and the fans trying to explain why their crap team deserves a draw after a 3-0 loss ("Well, their big lad was offside in the 1st phase of play,l for the 1st goal, plus jonesey had his shirt pulled on the 2nd and of Balloni had scored that chance...")
    "FFS Costa" with or without an apostrophe?

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Location
    Wombourne
    Posts
    2,122
    I think some refs would bottle it and run the time down, rather than overturning a decision.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Bilbrook
    Posts
    86,647
    It doesn't look to me like they're checking stuff in real time. Let's say it's a potential foul in the box, play goes on, ball eventually goes out and THEN the ref starts the process off. The VAR folk should be looking while the game is ongoing and alerting the ref as appropriate. As it is we get a dead pause from when the ball is dead...and it takes forever.

    Even as someone who is broadly on board (having seen it largely work well in Germany) I will admit it has been a poor experience so far. But it really hasn't helped Wolves fans' perceptions when literally everything has gone against us so far! Even the goals/penalties we've had begrudgingly given after a check leave a bit of a sour taste because again, the same standards don't seem to apply to everyone (yes, I'm going to mention that bloody offside at Everton again).

    I still say the "celebration" point doesn't stand up and never will in my book. I was up for all three incidents vs Southampton and had we scored a winner near the end I wouldn't have been holding back either.
    The rain falls hard on a humdrum town.

    http://oscillatingwildly.net
    Twitter
    Facebook

  14. #14
    Kenny's Avatar
    Kenny is offline Post Sponsored by the creators of the Gallimore Scale
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    42,323
    I will never be able buy into having a goal mental and after its died down we get told...after 2 mins...nah that didnt count.

    Nowt like when the ref or lino rule it out as you are stopped within seconds.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    4,150
    Techs fine

    The implementation of it is as bad as it could possibly have been

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Washington DC
    Posts
    6,508
    Quote Originally Posted by AndyWolves View Post
    Techs fine

    The implementation of it is as bad as it could possibly have been
    thanks bud
    <3 - guns, jesus, walmart, trucks, truck nuts, trump, brexit, rosters
    </3 - tea, kebabs, monarchies, EU, the deep state, nandos

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Norwich, UK
    Posts
    7,147
    Quote Originally Posted by Kenny View Post
    Communication is the main one for me. We need to know in the ground what is happening. I also agree with suggestion of a time limit. If it can't be decided in 30 seconds then it's not clear and obvious and you stick with the original decision.
    These two fix it for me - as it stands, it’s pretty shit.
    Feigning concern, a Labour pastime, makes you feel doubtful right from the start. The expression he pulls is exactly like last time, got to assume he just hasn't a brain!

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Northallerton
    Posts
    2,295
    Isn't it nice that the post match thread for the Villa Cup game is about the match and not how VAR has ruined it?
    "FFS Costa" with or without an apostrophe?

  19. #19
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    St. Neots, Cambs.
    Posts
    7,610
    There seems less problem with VAR this weekend in all matches?
    'Our goal is crystal clear: we will do our very best to help take Wolves back to the Premier League as soon as possible, and to stay there.'(21st July 2016). *Promotion achieved 15th April 2018.** 2019-7th-57pts-Qualify Europa*

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Derby
    Posts
    16,000
    Quote Originally Posted by Dinowolf View Post
    There seems less problem with VAR this weekend in all matches?
    Depends on your view of the Watford penalty. Ref sees contact followed by dive and doesn't give it. Another ref views it a different way. Gets given because the second opinion triumphs over the first.

    I saw it the same way as the ref on the pitch.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Wolverhampton
    Posts
    7,689
    I think everyone saw it the same way as the ref. No fuss over the Liverpool offside because it didnít affect the result in the end. Wasnít used in any other game as far as I know.
    As usual, Wolves fans being fickle. - Waggy on the Wing

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Nov 2017
    Location
    Lisbon
    Posts
    879
    Quote Originally Posted by Deutsch Wolf View Post
    Three issues for me right now:

    1) Speed. I mean Man City's second goal vs Villa. You don't need 20 replays to make your call on whether Sterling is interfering with play or not, and that is the only question. Surely you either think he is or he isn't. Why all the delay?

    2) Communication inside the grounds, trust the fans FFS. Show the pictures, put the audio over the Tannoy (TM).

    3) Consistency - the biggest one. Let's have a look yesterday at United's penalty on James and our non-penalty on Doherty. You might decide that they're both penalties. You might decide that neither are, there isn't really enough in it. You can't have it where one is given and one isn't! This is supposed to give us definitive answers with the benefit of having multiple angles and extra time to have a look in slow motion, not give us another level of subjectivity.

    Fans do need to grow up a bit with it. It's no good flinging your arms around and having a tantrum, or indulging in genuinely mental conspiracy theories. It's here, it isn't going to go away. So the concerns need to be voiced sensibly, then perhaps the authorities will listen.
    The tech is fine, the main issue is the form in which it is used. Especially the last point. That is down to the refs, their criteria and the lack of specific criteria on which a given foul is given. This isn't relevant only to VAR situations, however.

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    4,686
    Handball by Dele Ali in the box today. Accidental in my view. Not given as a pen.
    Handball by Boly at Leicester - equally accidental - goal chalked off.
    It's the inconsistency that gets me - and yes, a time limit seems an obvious (and therefore far too simple) solution
    Oh - and shirt pull on Doherty last week: far clearer than Ali's handball - not given
    Wolves 2017/18 P46 W27 D11 L8 F85 A40 Pts 92: 2 pts a game is all we need...

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    South Normanton
    Posts
    21,254
    Quote Originally Posted by Norman Deeley View Post
    Handball by Dele Ali in the box today. Accidental in my view. Not given as a pen.
    Handball by Boly at Leicester - equally accidental - goal chalked off.
    It's the inconsistency that gets me - and yes, a time limit seems an obvious (and therefore far too simple) solution
    Oh - and shirt pull on Doherty last week: far clearer than Ali's handball - not given
    The Boly decision was perfectly consistent with the rules though.

    Think Alli was a very lucky boy to avoid conceding a penalty, not sure why VAR took so long looking at it, blatantly came off his arm as he was waving them above his head and not really going for the ball, didn't hit anyone to deflect onto him. Surely that should tie in with the whole 'unnatural position' line and mean it's a penalty?

    Thought the Son penalty shout that was looked at was a joke too, bit of contact on his heel from Mina's midriff as the latter slid along and Son tried to turn but then suddenly both feet come flying up a foot off the ground like he's been completely cleaned out. Should've been booked.
    If you see a Possum, try to kill it, 'kay, it's not a pet.

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    470
    VAR should have been used to overturn Son’s red card today, as it was a clearly-wrong decision made in the heat of the moment for totally understandable reasons. That it wasn’t seems a complete waste of the tech.

  26. #26
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Derby
    Posts
    16,000
    Quote Originally Posted by Norman Deeley View Post
    Handball by Dele Ali in the box today. Accidental in my view. Not given as a pen.
    Handball by Boly at Leicester - equally accidental - goal chalked off
    That's not the rules though. Offensive= handball everytime. Defensive= unnatural position.

    It's a debate whether Alli's is or isn't, but your point isn't the debate

  27. #27
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Stafford
    Posts
    13,323
    What a load of utter bollocks
    )

  28. #28
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Derby
    Posts
    16,000
    I don't make the laws/rules, just saying what they are

  29. #29
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Stafford
    Posts
    13,323
    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Towner View Post
    I don't make the laws/rules, just saying what they are
    Yep, not aimed at you in the slightest. Itís just that rule and the whole VAR shite is just bollocks.
    )

  30. #30
    GLASGOWOLF is offline Not English you say? Got my eyes on you then
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    2,767
    After today they can fuck VAR off until we stop having refs that refuse to go against an onfield ref.

    The FA should but the won't read the riot act to the Refs.
    I have to think refs are in collusion with not upsetting each other.
    The alternative does not bare thinking about in England as it starts to point to corruption.

    Tackle on Son where the ball was not touched
    Ali's Hand Ball, his hand was in an unnatural position
    And to make it worse the Red card for Son.

Similar Threads

  1. 'no socially useful purpose'
    By Hereford Wolf in forum General Chatter
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 28th October 2012, 12:01 AM
  2. Moxey - unfit for purpose
    By waggy on the wing in forum Wolves
    Replies: 159
    Last Post: 6th June 2011, 05:26 PM
  3. My Life Purpose
    By AllGold in forum General Chatter
    Replies: 52
    Last Post: 26th February 2011, 09:30 AM

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •