Results 1 to 6 of 6

Thread: Early goals and late goals.

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Everywhere and nowhere, baby.
    Posts
    516

    Early goals and late goals.

    From what I saw and read and heard last season, and in the start to this one, a lot of our games have the following pattern to them:

    Early problems

    We start really slowly. The other team has masses of the ball for the first ten/twenty/thirty minutes. Sometimes the whole half, but usually just the first ten or fifteen or twenty minutes. Hahnemann pulls off a lot of saves, some of them of a very high standard. The other team hits the woodwork, maybe. We don't seem capable of holding the ball, much less mounting worthwhile attacks.

    We get a grip

    Sometimes this happens straight after the other team finally manage to score, and sometimes it just happens. We come to terms with the game, and start to look good. We score.

    We hang on

    With the arrival of the last ten minutes, the opposition is frustrated that they are not beating us, or are even losing. They up the pace. Maybe Mick starts putting more defensive players on. We hang on desperately, with Hahnemann again making a lot of saves.



    Last season this worked out well for us, but this season it isn't working well at all. We are conceding early and late goals. However, if you are playing crap for the first twenty minutes of almost every game you play, and are having to play very defensively for the last ten minutes of many games, you are going to concede early goals and late goals. What is happening to us now is more natural than what was happening last season.

    Goals are the whole point of the game, and yet the problem isn't really that we are conceding the early and late goals, but rather the sluggish start, the inability to kill games, and the heroic defending of the last ten minutes. These are the actual problems, I think, and taken together they make the early goals and the late goals almost inevitable at this level. Maybe only the form of Hahnemann, Craddock and Berra, and perhaps a little luck, allowed us to get away with it last season.
    Betfair relegation odds at 17.40 on 3/12/10 (previous was 22.50 on 25/11/10):

    Wigan 1.88 (-0.18), West Ham 1.92 (+0.21), Wolves 1.97 (+0.21), Blackpool 1.98 (no change), Birmingham 5.70 (no change), Fulham 5.8 (-2.00), West Brom 6.2 (+1.6). Everybody else 10.0 or above.

  2. #2
    I don't think there is anything that can be done to reverse the recent trend of conceding goals as we have done. It doesn't matter when goals are scored, they are either due to good attacking play or poor defensive play - usually a combination of both. Varney's goal yesterday was a great example, he took a chance after being afforded the opportunity by Foley's error. On another day it would have either fallen into the keeper's arms or sailed high wide and handsome. On anther day Hahnamman would have done a lot better for the second goal or Jarvis would have been able to clear it off the line. For both goals, there was nothing tactically that could be done to prevent it.

    Against Manchester United, Park's goals were just good football from good footballers - individual players might have made different decisions that might have resulted in different outcomes but we are talking split second decisions being made.

    Aresenal's first goal was speculative, but the goalscorer did really well to find himself in the right place at the right time. Their second goal was due to the fact that we were pressing for a (deserved) equaliser.

    There have been others this season that can be put down to individual (and collective) errors - the Bolton goal for example - and there is nothing than tactics or formations can do to resolve this.

    The most unfortunate aspect of this season is that apart from the Wigan game (and to a lesser extent Bolton) we have been in with a chance of collecting points in every single game we've played. In most games we have experienced periods of domination, played well and created chances. We are playing better this year on a more consistent basis than we ever did last year.

    But we can't convert our performances into victories and whether we play 4-4-2, 4-4-3 or any combination of either nothing will mitigate for individual errors or good attacking play.

    In short, we're in trouble and the only thing that is really going to help us is luck - some bad luck for our opponents and some good luck for us.
    No.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    915
    Maybe we have had some bad luck, but the table doesn't lie. We are our own worst enemies. Three games running we have given a goal away in the first minute or so. We are then chasing games, and missing chances for fun. Lose next week and we really are in very big trouble.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Mrs Tisi View Post
    Maybe we have had some bad luck, but the table doesn't lie. We are our own worst enemies. Three games running we have given a goal away in the first minute or so. We are then chasing games, and missing chances for fun. Lose next week and we really are in very big trouble.
    But what would you do to change it if you were Mick. Tell the strikers not to miss chances? Tell the defeners and keepers not to concede?
    No.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Everywhere and nowhere, baby.
    Posts
    516
    Hopefully we are already working on those on the training ground each week.

    Again, though, I don't see the early goals as the illness. They are an annoying symptom of the underlying illness. It's the symptom which is hurting us, but we won't eliminate that symptom without eliminating the underlying illness - the slow starts.

    Assuming that people agree with me about us starting the majority of games badly off the pace, there has to be a reason for this, surely? If the reason is that we are simply an inferior team, but can sometimes get along okay if we survive the first quarter of the game, largely because teams get frustrated that they haven't beaten us yet and start to play badly themselves, then there might not be much that can be done. We seem to start badly against bad teams as well, though. So there must be more to it.

    If there is any pattern to our poor starts, then it needs to be identified and worked on. I don't know what that pattern might be. I sincerely hope that Mick and the rest of the staff are studying the early match stats and matching them against the general stats and trying to see what is going on.

    However, if I was in charge the huddle would stop. (I assume we still do this? Otherwise I'm going to look stupid again.) What good is it doing us? What are they actually saying to each other? 'Right, let's start really sloppily and rely on our two central defenders, our goalie, and a little bit of good luck for the first twenty minutes?' It isn't working, so scrap it. At the last minute, as the players are walking together shout 'Oh, don't bother with a huddle today lads. We know what we've got to do, just get into position and do it. Come on lads.' Then clap your hands twice, give a thumbs-up and turn and walk away. Our routine isn't working, so do anything to shake it up.
    Last edited by PassItPassIt; 22nd November 2010 at 03:07 AM. Reason: typo
    Betfair relegation odds at 17.40 on 3/12/10 (previous was 22.50 on 25/11/10):

    Wigan 1.88 (-0.18), West Ham 1.92 (+0.21), Wolves 1.97 (+0.21), Blackpool 1.98 (no change), Birmingham 5.70 (no change), Fulham 5.8 (-2.00), West Brom 6.2 (+1.6). Everybody else 10.0 or above.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    South Normanton
    Posts
    21,405
    I dont think the long punt up the pitch from kick off helps us, why dont we keep the ball? Let some of our players get a touch, try and dictate the tempo in the opening stages. Instead we gift possession to the opposition and then most of our players first touch is a tackle or a clearance instead of receiving and making passes with their team mates.

    And Saturday boy, what can Mick do about it? Maybe he could drop the out of form striker thats missing the chances, give the top scorer thats had minimal opportunities a chance to establish himself? Maybe he could drop the keeper thats looked well below the required standard of late and give the young lad desperate to play a chance to impress? I think the defence are struggling at the moment but they've had some issues with suspensions and injuries lately so theres been a fair bit of chopping and changing so they need some time to settle down. Its starting to bug me that we have the same out of form players starting every week when there are alternatives in most cases that dont get more than 10 minutes in some games to stake their claim for a spot in the team, Doyle, Hunt, Henry and Hahnemann have been below par for several weeks and i think we could do better with Hennessey, Fletcher and Mancienne at least, theres not really a direct replacement for Hunt at the moment. I dont think Mick will make the changes though, he seems scared to drop Doyle, he loves Henry for some reason and i bet he wont drop Hahnemann half as quick as he did Hennessey last season, if he's not willing to make the changes then Morgan may have to make a change of his own sometime soon. We have a good squad, better than at least 3 teams in this league, better than it was last year, but we're not making the most of it at all this season and i think you have to blame the management team for that. Maybe we just need a new face or 2 in the coaching team to bring some fresh views and ideas but again i dont think Mick, being as stubborn as he is, would do such a thing off his own back, Morgan may have to force the issue and that could reallly upset things.

Bookmarks

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •