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Wolves 1-0 West Ham: Verdict Thread

Tredman

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Whether it was intentional or not, its not disrespectful to say Neves got one wrong, it doesn't happen often, he will make the occasional mistake due to what he's trying to attempt.
Spot on.
 

Elephant Pyjamas

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Whether it was intentional or not, its not disrespectful to say Neves got one wrong, it doesn't happen often, he will make the occasional mistake due to what he's trying to attempt. It might make me sound like an old far (I am) but in modern day society it seems you are never allowed to make mistake and should be vilified for every one you do make.

Not sure what you are talking about here to be honest.

Who has said he isn't allowed to make a mistake? Neither those who think it was or wasn't intentional have said that.

But those who do think it wasn't intentional clearly have less faith or belief in Neves's ability, that is obvious.
 

sycophantia

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Well yeah spot on, other than the obvious fact that he didn't get one wrong at all, so totally not even slightly spot on at all.
I was talking generally rather than the main talking point. I've watched it about 10 times and from the angles I've seen, I'm still not sure one way or the other, anyway I was trying to make the point it's irrelevant....if that makes me disrespectful, then I just have to take that on the chin.
 

sycophantia

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Not sure what you are talking about here to be honest.

Who has said he isn't allowed to make a mistake? Neither those who think it was or wasn't intentional have said that.

But those who do think it wasn't intentional clearly have less faith or belief in Neves's ability, that is obvious.
It's not having less faith, quite the opposite imo, if anyone thought it was a miss kick and mention it, it shows that they were surprised,,as its Neves.
 

North Shropshire Lad

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Even the greatest players in history make mistakes EP. Wondering whether Neves miss hit something or whether it was deliberate is not being disrespectful, it's just debating if he meant it or not. No more, no less.

On this occasion I have absolutely no idea and neither do the commentators on television, regardless of the number of times they or I have seen him play.
 

Elephant Pyjamas

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Even the greatest players in history make mistakes EP.

Yes they do, but not to the extent you are suggesting Neves would have here for this failed shot to have seen the ball ending up there, it's just ludicrous, especially for a player of his ability.

His failed efforts on goal over the last couple of seasons haven't been going out towards the corner flag or going out for a throw in have they? They have been high or wide, or both, but at least in the general direction of the goal, this pass spun out wonderfully to his right.

The way he shaped his body, and the angle he needed to put on the ball to get it where it did were consistent.

It wasn't a shot.

As i said initially, if you are someone who has watched Neves play many games you shouldn't even be questioning it as you are denying the evidence of your eyes over the last 150 games or so, let alone the evidence of the moment itself.

(which is why a random commentator thinks it's a shot, but Burrows knows it isn't)
 
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North Shropshire Lad

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I generally think Messi and Ronaldo are fairly decent players. Others tend to agree with me. Look at their recent miskicks/slides/shanks for Argentina against Columbia [Messi's 'shot' actually went backwards] and Ronnie's near post effort against Newcastle [where It went further away from the target than the point it was when it started] and tell me again that it's impossible for someone of Neves' ability to miss hit a ball.

I'm not saying he's shit, that we should sell him or that he should never shoot again. Indeed I'm not even suggesting that this wasn't deliberate, but to die in a ditch on this is very odd. I'll also reiterate, it doesn't matter how many times you've seen a player, you can never be 100% sure whether they meant something or not. Burrows vs random commentator/you vs me.

For the record: to save you saying I've probably not seen Neves many times then, I have ;)
 

Elephant Pyjamas

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I mean just look at it, there are people who think he is has fucked his technique up so much that is either attempting a shot with the outside of his right foot, or he's trying to lace it and has screwed it up to such an extent it's approaching the corner flag!?? Really?

Not only am I wondering if you people have bothered to watch Neves properly, or whether you've even kicked a football yourselves.

Just ludicrous, he knows exactly what he is doing.

 

Elephant Pyjamas

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I generally think Messi and Ronaldo are fairly decent players. Others tend to agree with me. Look at their recent miskicks/slides/shanks for Argentina against Columbia [Messi's 'shot' actually went backwards] and Ronnie's near post effort against Newcastle [where It went further away from the target than the point it was when it started] and tell me again that it's impossible for someone of Neves' ability to miss hit a ball.

I'm not saying he's shit, that we should sell him or that he should never shoot again. Indeed I'm not even suggesting that this wasn't deliberate, but to die in a ditch on this is very odd. I'll also reiterate, it doesn't matter how many times you've seen a player, you can never be 100% sure whether they meant something or not. Burrows vs random commentator/you vs me.

For the record: to save you saying I've probably not seen Neves many times then, I have ;)
I'm just looking at the evidence of what I am seeing in front of me pal, and that is Neves playing a lovely pass out wide.

Maybe Raul miss hit his finish too, I mean if people want to make a stupid argument.
 

Tredman

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No one is actually saying he mis-hit, like others I don’t know (and I was there and fairly in line with Joao). It’s just totally bizarre to say that criticising him (or any of our players) is disrespectful. The days of forelock tugging should be over.
 

North Shropshire Lad

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Not only am I wondering if you people have bothered to watch Neves properly, or whether you've even kicked a football yourselves.
Really? FFS

EP's Top trumps:
How many times have you seen Neves?
How many times have you watched Neves 'properly'?
Have you played football yourself?
Who for?
Can you disguise a pass so that the thousands/hundreds/man and his dog watching are left unsure as to whether it was brilliant or a miss kick?
 

1986

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Forgot about that delayed start, from memory the injury happened about this time of year?

Still, misleading to suggest those opening 13 games last season were sans Jimenez, he'll have played vast majority.
Our form began to wane in December and we never really got a sustained run after that . In addition we were conceding a lot to some teams - 4 to West Ham away and 3 at home , 3 to Man City at home and 4 away , 4 away to Liverpool , 4 at home to Burnley , 3 away to Brighton .
So far this season our defensive record is much better , but it's as brittle thing one can't forget .
Norwich and Burnley matches are now really important when you consider what's coming directly after that . We owe Burnley big time and Kilman adds the physicality that was lacking before in dealing with big front men .
Norwich will be tricky - they're on a little run , new manager bounce and all that .
 

WsWolf

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Burnley worries me less after the way we dealt with West ham who while not as direct are every bit as physical generally. Dean Smith is an awful manager and Norwich have the worst squad in the league by miles, be amazed if they pick up any more points per game than they have already.
 

Elephant Pyjamas

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Of course it is, it shouldn't even be a debate, or a debate of a debate.

And yes it is disrespectful nay insulting to suggest that's a shot, just fucking look at it!
 
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