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Farage Ltd and Similar Watch

Law's Bus said:
Stand on a platform with fascists, then you are a fascist.

It's really not difficult to figure out.
Click to expand...

So that’s every single person out Saturday given the F-label 🙄

Oh well, I guess it was naive to think when your strategy backfires and drives the tide against you the last thing you’d do is continue to do the same.

If we’re not going to learn from what happened in America we might as well just get on and prepare ourselves for what’s coming.
 
Ennabling and/or condoning fascists is as bad, if not worse in some ways, and you're as guilty even by not challenging their behaviour.

This is a significant issue for those on the left. You try to be reasonable, you try to compromise, you try to be fair and find the middle ground, and you end up signing away hard fought concessions, and end up with an outcome that no one wants.

The right and far right refuse to concede ground, ever. Hence the narrative constantly shifts towards their favoured viewpoint.
 
I don't care whether you want to apply a fascist label to it, if you nod along with the views of Tommy Robinson, Laurence Fox and Katie Hopkins, you're a cunt and I have no interest in discussing anything with you, civilly or otherwise.
 
EpsomWolf said:
So that’s every single person out Saturday given the F-label 🙄

Oh well, I guess it was naive to think when your strategy backfires and drives the tide against you the last thing you’d do is continue to do the same.

If we’re not going to learn from what happened in America we might as well just get on and prepare ourselves for what’s coming.
Click to expand...
Brexit, Farage, Reform...the list keeps growing
 
There’s a difference in agreeing with some of what is being said to wholeheartedly endorsing everything. The breakdown in ability and willingness to discuss and deal with the legitimate concerns from the right and the derogatory and inaccurate labels applied is only going to drive the lunatics further right, but also generate a ‘fuck you’ attitude from the moderates back to those giving it to them.

Looks pretty much like it’s a future of Farage as PM and everyone hating each other after all. It’s not as though the warning signs weren’t there.
 
Well if you can give me a list of all the political points that say, Laurence Fox has made, and then point out the ones where you might think "actually, he's not far off there", I'm all ears.
 
The problem is if you just demonise all the people that were there, they'll just respond in kind and there'll be no discussion.
There will definitely have been people there who thought they were protesting about a just issue, personally I have no idea what that issue is, no idea what 'taking back our country' even means.
Ive spoken to people who have sympathies with the protesters. When questioned on it, a lot didn't know Tommy Robinson was involved (they all thought he was a scumbag), virtually none had ever heard of Katie Hopkins or Lawrence Fox.
Now you may say that's their fault for being ill educated or ignorant but that also closes off any discussion. So where do we go from here? Just let the far right nut jobs control the narrative? If feels like we're heading well down the path of facism.
Quite frankly I'm shitting myself about it, what world are my grandkids going to grow up in?
Ive no idea how to change the trend but I'm pretty sure just condemning people who are just badly informed rather than extreme right activists isn't the answer.
 
I (like most people i guess) have had a ton of Charlie Kirk videos pushed into their feeds, i've watched a few and he comes across as engaging and articulate. I didn't always agree with what he says, but he explains his position.

He was at least willing to engage and allow people to challenge him
 
AndyWolves said:
I (like most people i guess) have had a ton of Charlie Kirk videos pushed into their feeds, i've watched a few and he comes across as engaging and articulate. I didn't always agree with what he says, but he explains his position.

He was at least willing to engage and allow people to challenge him
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This is exactly my experience too.

And i didn't expect to feel that way.
 
If you can't understand some of the frustrations many on the march have - most obviously wages at the lower end stagnating, bills going up, public services, be it NHS, roads, schools, housing and many more in a poor state - then you'll never get them back on side and voting for you.

Burying heads in the sand and saying they're all racist won't help. They see 50,000 people arriving in small boats each year and putting the issues of perceived crime to one side - that's just an easy way to justify their frustration - they also see the population rising by the equivalent of a small town and requiring the resources that go with it. More pressure on the NHS, schools and all other other services. They see translators being provided, food provided and they wonder why the money can be found for that yet they have to wait three weeks for a GP appointment.

Throw in many will encounter them in dodgy businesses such as barbers, nail parlours and mobile phone accessory shops like the ones in Shrewsbury raided earlier this year and they feel angry that so many such businesses have sprung up and can't possibly be making a legitimate living.

A mate of mine recently said he has no issue with offering refuge to some people each year but we shouldn't be deciding who based on who is able to get to France and cross the Channel in a small boat. In his words: "If three million Iranians, Sudanese and Afghans turn up are we just going to accept them all as their life back home was shit?"

Failing to engage with them will inevitably ensure they take the view that they are right and become more entrenched in their views. I'm not sure how to engage them but I do know that failure to do so will ensure a Reform government next time.
 
Only about 50% of asylum claims are accepted, so no, its not just 'accept them all as their life back home was shit'
 
Wilf Wolf said:
A mate of mine recently said he has no issue with offering refuge to some people each year but we shouldn't be deciding who based on who is able to get to France and cross the Channel in a small boat.
Click to expand...
is this not because we don’t offer any safe routes for refugees?
 
AndyWolves said:
I (like most people i guess) have had a ton of Charlie Kirk videos pushed into their feeds, i've watched a few and he comes across as engaging and articulate. I didn't always agree with what he says, but he explains his position.

He was at least willing to engage and allow people to challenge him
Click to expand...
On X?
 
visage said:
The stats are really easy to find - I dont know while people just make up any old bollocks and think they can get away with it.
Click to expand...
I think we do know why but that would upset the ones saying we should appease bigots
 
Wilf Wolf said:
A mate of mine recently said he has no issue with offering refuge to some people each year but we shouldn't be deciding who based on who is able to get to France and cross the Channel in a small boat.
Click to expand...
I suppose he was happy with 300 and odd thousand white Ukranians?
 
Wilf Wolf said:
Failing to engage with them will inevitably ensure they take the view that they are right and become more entrenched in their views. I'm not sure how to engage them but I do know that failure to do so will ensure a Reform government next time.
Click to expand...
Last week I did try and engage with a bloke who interrupted a conversation I was having in my hotel with another person on the issue of asylum seekers. The engagement went along tbese lines;

You mean illegal immigrants.
No, they're asylum seekers.
Illegal immigrants
Asylum seekers who have had all safe and legal routes removed from them by the government.
They're illegal immigrants. Where do you live?
I'm not telling you where I live as it has no bearing on the discussion.
I bet you don't live in a place that houses the illegal immigrants.
Actually I do.
Where's that?
It's irrelevant.

At this point I disengaged and went to bed.
 
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