Farage Ltd and Similar Watch

[Wilf Wolf]

is this not because we don’t offer any safe routes for refugees?

I agree entirely. This is what I posted a while ago…

The only way you have a chance to stop the boats is reach an agreement with the EU that those in them can be returned. The only way the EU might agree to that is if we processed asylum claims in France but that would require the UK to agree to some kind of annual quota and that would be political dynamite.

I think most people accept we should take a share of asylum seekers and it makes sense to accept those that have a support network of family already here, especially for Afghans who helped us as interpreters and should already be here but for the chaotic exit. If a suitable system was agreed and anyone who tried to enter the UK illegally was automatically barred from accessing the legal route it would act as a very strong deterrent. Anyone granted asylum could then enter through normal routes and would just be a small part of the overall immigration numbers.

I’m sure there’s a flaw in this but I can’t think of a better option.

 

[Wilf Wolf]

108,000 people claimed asylum in the UK last year.

The stats are really easy to find - I dont know while people just make up any old bollocks and think they can get away with it.

How many people claim asylum in the UK?

www.gov.uk

I was making the point that a question often raised is how many asylum seekers is too many. I wasn’t for one second saying there are 3 million, but you knew that? How many would you accept?

 

[sycophantia]

Last week I did try and engage with a bloke who interrupted a conversation I was having in my hotel with another person on the issue of asylum seekers. The engagement went along tbese lines;

You mean illegal immigrants.
No, they're asylum seekers.
Illegal immjgrants
Asylum seekers who have had all safe and legal routes removed from them by the government.
They're illegal immigrants. Where do you live?
I'm not telling you where I live as it has ni bearing on the discussion.
I bet you don't live in a place that houses the illegal immigrants.
Actually I do.
Where's that?
It's irrelevant.

At this point I disengaged and went to bed.

You did exactly the right thing imo, although ultimately you couldn't convince him. If more people like you took the time to try and debate the point, maybe eventually the truth would get through. It feels atm that some whose opinion is more akin to yours (and mine) are just giving up debate and just getting more and more angry. I understand why they are frustrated but what's the alternative? Both sides of the divide becoming more and more polar with their views. It's getting very dark, very quickly.
For those of us around in the 70s, I don't want to see running battles on the streets again, that would be terrible, especially now we have sm.

 

[leedswolf]

I agree entirely. This is what I posted a while ago…

The only way you have a chance to stop the boats is reach an agreement with the EU that those in them can be returned. The only way the EU might agree to that is if we processed asylum claims in France but that would require the UK to agree to some kind of annual quota and that would be political dynamite.

I think most people accept we should take a share of asylum seekers and it makes sense to accept those that have a support network of family already here, especially for Afghans who helped us as interpreters and should already be here but for the chaotic exit. If a suitable system was agreed and anyone who tried to enter the UK illegally was automatically barred from accessing the legal route it would act as a very strong deterrent. Anyone granted asylum could then enter through normal routes and would just be a small part of the overall immigration numbers.

I’m sure there’s a flaw in this but I can’t think of a better option.

The fundamental flaw being that an asylum seeker has to be on 'British' soil in order to claim asylum. So what would the legal route be given that even if they use an illegal route they can still claim asylum?

 

[Wilf Wolf]

The fundamental flaw being that an asylum seeker has to be on 'British' soil in order to claim asylum. So what would the legal route be?

Presumably assessed in France - isn’t that what is currently happening with the one for one returns?

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

You did exactly the right thing imo, although ultimately you couldn't convince him. If more people like you took the time to try and debate the point, maybe eventually the truth would get through. It feels atm that some whose opinion is more akin to yours (and mine) are just giving up debate and just getting more and more angry. I understand why they are frustrated but what's the alternative? Both sides of the divide becoming more and more polar with their views. It's getting very dark, very quickly.
For those of us around in the 70s, I don't want to see running battles on the streets again, that would be terrible, especially now we have sm.

As someone who grew up in the 80s - in a West Midlands where multiculturalism was a default, and we've had 40 years following on of it - I have no time for discussing politics or indeed anything who think England is the exclusive preserve of white people.

They're not worth talking to.

 

[leedswolf]

Presumably assessed in France - isn’t that what is currently happening with the one for one returns?

Which bypasses the UK's oblgation to those wanting to claim asylum under International Law.

 

[visage]

I was making the point that a question often raised is how many asylum seekers is too many. I wasn’t for one second saying there are 3 million, but you knew that? How many would you accept?

As many as want to apply. We have obligations under international law.

If we ever get to the point where the numbers are putting us under pressure then sure, let's reassess. But there's no sign we're even close to that point.

 

[sycophantia]

As someone who grew up in the 80s - in a West Midlands where multiculturalism was a default, and we've had 40 years following on of it - I have no time for discussing politics or indeed anything who think England is the exclusive preserve of white people.

They're not worth talking to.

That's the point I'm trying to make, I don't think all of the people at that protest are racist or bigoted. Maybe I'm just naive.
Anyway time for me to bow out of this discussion, It's the third time in less than a week and I'm going down a deep hole fast.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

That's the point I'm trying to make, I don't think all of the people at that protest are racist or bigoted. Maybe I'm just naive.

I don't think they are either.

But a lot of them are, and the people they're listening to definitely are.

 

[Wilf Wolf]

As many as want to apply. We have obligations under international law.

If we ever get to the point where the numbers are putting us under pressure then sure, let's reassess. But there's no sign we're even close to that point.

Opinions vary. I’d rather not see more and more of our countryside turned into housing estates.

 

[sycophantia]

I don't think they are either.

But a lot of them are, and the people they're listening to definitely are.

That's the people such as me, you, Leeds, YW etc should be targeting (I'm doing my best)with the alternative view. I have to believe we havent lost them all completely yet.

 

[leedswolf]

Opinions vary. I’d rather not see more and more of our countryside turned into housing estates.

1.3% of land in England is classified as residential, which includes buildings like houses and flats. An additional 4.9% of land is classified as residential gardens.

 

[The Saturday Boy]

I agree entirely. This is what I posted a while ago…

The only way you have a chance to stop the boats is reach an agreement with the EU that those in them can be returned. The only way the EU might agree to that is if we processed asylum claims in France but that would require the UK to agree to some kind of annual quota and that would be political dynamite.

I think most people accept we should take a share of asylum seekers and it makes sense to accept those that have a support network of family already here, especially for Afghans who helped us as interpreters and should already be here but for the chaotic exit. If a suitable system was agreed and anyone who tried to enter the UK illegally was automatically barred from accessing the legal route it would act as a very strong deterrent. Anyone granted asylum could then enter through normal routes and would just be a small part of the overall immigration numbers.

I’m sure there’s a flaw in this but I can’t think of a better option.

What do you mean by “a share of asylum seekers”? Compared to global nations we take very few asylum seekers, even in Europe we have less asylum claims than some other countries. We have spent decades not taking our share of asylum seekers while at the same time demonising asylum seekers and restricting safe and legal routes.

The truth and the rhetoric have been allowed to drift so far apart, any meaningful solution appears out of reach of the current political class…either by choice or design.

 

[AndyWolves]

On X?

Yeah

 

[leedswolf]

That's the point I'm trying to make, I don't think all of the people at that protest are racist or bigoted. Maybe I'm just naive.
Anyway time for me to bow out of this discussion, It's the third time in less than a week and I'm going down a deep hole fast.

Equally, not all racists or bigots attend protests.

 

[Tredman]

Yeah

Perhaps consider a news source which doesn’t have a promotional algorithm cultivated by a Nazi.

 

[Wilf Wolf]

1.3% of land in England is classified as residential, which includes buildings like houses and flats. An additional 4.9% of land is classified as residential gardens.

England as a whole maybe, but in many more populated areas it is much higher. There’s plans to nearly double the size of Eccleshall and Stafford is expanding massively. Might not bother you but I appreciate the green spaces around here and don’t want to lose them.

 

[leedswolf]

England as a whole maybe, but in many more populated areas it is much higher. There’s plans to nearly double the size of Eccleshall and Stafford is expanding massively. Might not bother you but I appreciate the green spaces around here and don’t want to lose them.

I haven't stated that it doesn't bother me. I lived in Stone when the population was 3.5k. However, it is sadly inevitable that there will be areas that are more preferable to develop.

 

[Law's Bus]

So that’s every single person out Saturday given the F-label

Yes, it absolutely is. There is no reason to go on a march led by fascists if you're not a fascist, or at the very least a fascist enabler.

Having concerns is fine. Having a frank and open discussion is fine. Being right of centre is fine (if misguided IMHO). But going on a march with the 2020s equivalent of the National Front, when you know exactly who is leading it and speaking at it? Behave.