Loans

[YoungWolf]

I can't help but think we are missing a trick here.

I understand that Kenny doesn't like to use loans as a temporary stop gap, and that worked well with Henry and Jacobs coming in and having a good impact last season and signing permanently soon after. There are also arguments that we shouldn't be developing players for other teams.

However, if we loan a young player from a top six or seven side and they are a success, the bonus for us is that the same club will know they can trust us to develop footballers and want to send us more in the future. Equally, other young players will want to come to the club and not just necessarily on loan either.

I look at Middlesbrough, and wonder if they would be as strong as they have been this season without Bamford, Fredericks, Omeruo, Vossen and now Kalas too I think? I know Karanka has good links with Mourinho and others within the game but I don't feel that having Kenny Jackett as our manager makes us any less a good opportunity for talented young players. Brentford and Derby are benefitting from loan players too giving them more options to choose from, while Boruc has been great for Bournemouth.

Bournemouth - Boruc

Middlesbrough - Omeruo, Fredericks, Kalas, Vossen, Bamford

Derby - Ince, Lingard, Mascarell, Bent (Also had Shotton who has since signed permanently)

Ipswich - Williams (Also had Noel Hunt who has since signed permanently)

Watford - No idea who in their squad is their's and who is on loan...

Norwich - No one as far as I can see, managed to keep a lot of players following relegation

Brentford - Pritchard, Toral, Long, Betinho.

Us - Sagbo, Graham. (Jordan Graham too who has since been made permanent).

I just wonder if we could have strengthened just a little more, and not at a lot of cost, and given ourselves more of a chance to push properly for the play offs at least. Is it something that we should be looking at, or is the policy fine as it is? The only loans we have brought in have been when Dicko was injured and we were left with Clarke and McAlinden.

 

[sycophantia]

Good point YW, also it might be the time to bring in loan players in positions we know to be weak with a view to permanent signing in the summer.

 

[Tony Towner]

We undoubtedly need to add two players to our squad. A midfield player to challenge / replace McDonald who has gone from player of the season to someone that needs taking out of the team and a number 10 or forward depending on where KJ sees Afobe playing. From what I have read we played 442 yesterday (Afobe just behind Dicko, but not playing deep enough to be classed as being in midfield).

To not have a forward on the bench (because we don't have a credible option) is bad management / planning for me and needs to be sorted. I think we will wait until we can sign someone that will still be here for the play off final, meaning we'll wait another fortnight before bringing someone in.

I do understand why KJ doesn't want to bring in players who we ultimately won't sign permanently, but I think this now needs to be put to the side for the greater good of the team. We desperately need someone to drive the team on from the middle of the park, to do the job that McDonald isn't, I would prefer them to be experienced, but if they happen to be young with a big career ahead of them them so be it......I appreciate this is easier said than done!

 

[Alan]

Although I'm typically very against temp loan signings (old trope about developing someone else's players and whatnot), as I see it now our alternative is playing Edwards, who isn't really going to grow as a player from here on out anyway.

May as well loan in a "no potential" player that helps us get into the playoffs than continue to play one we own who won't.

 

[Carrotdude]

I don't like the idea of signing someone on loan with no chance of it becoming permanent but there must be viable options around who could improve our midfield in particular.

 

[visage]

Dont forget that loans can only be 93 days. If we're hoping to be in the playoffs then we're unlikely to get anyone in more than 93 days before the final. Im not sure of the exact date that would be, but its going to be sometime around next weekend on the basis that its about three months and the playoff final is the 25th May.

 

[visage]

If my maths is right then that would be Saturday.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

I don't like the idea of signing someone on loan with no chance of it becoming permanent but there must be viable options around who could improve our midfield in particular.

I think this season they'd be perfectly acceptable, even more so for a club in Wolves position.

Only now are we starting to see any real stand out sides or anything like a breakaway pack in the Championship this season, it's as close as it's been in a long while for promotion so as a simple means to an end solution i'd see no problem with any side taking a kid on loan from a top side with zerhttp://www.wolvesforum.co.uk/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=741750o chance of getting them permanently just to get themselves a seat at the top table. It brings a whole new world of possibilities for the club, think how much easier it'd be to recruit better players when you've got Premier League football on offer, even if it does mean you've an extra replacement to find because one of your promotion stars has gone back to their parent club.

Also for a club like Wolves at the moment, in the final year of the parachute payments, it makes sense to chance that promotion from a purely financial standpoint, you could end up with your 2-3 most important players being loanees which hamstrings you next year in the Premier League when they've fucked off home but it gives you so much more to work with to rebuild for the next few years after that even if you sink like a stone in the top flight.

There's a time and place for pretty much every type of signing, remember Blues signing broken old Dugarry years back to keep them up, he was useless after that but he'd done his job for them. A couple of top loans could well do the same for Wolves this season, there might be no chance of getting them long term but it'd still give the club a hell of a boost in the long term if they helped to earn promotion.

 

[Tony Towner]

We have another season of parachute payments, this is the third of four

 

[MARKakaJIM]

We have another season of parachute payments, this is the third of four

Point still stands, why linger in this league with substantial income drop on the horizon?

Next year might see 2 teams run away with the automatic places from day 1 and make promotion immediately more difficult to achieve than it looks this season.

I fear Wolves may be to principled and could well be their own worst enemy on this point.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

I can't help but think we are missing a trick here.

I understand that Kenny doesn't like to use loans as a temporary stop gap, and that worked well with Henry and Jacobs coming in and having a good impact last season and signing permanently soon after. There are also arguments that we shouldn't be developing players for other teams.

However, if we loan a young player from a top six or seven side and they are a success, the bonus for us is that the same club will know they can trust us to develop footballers and want to send us more in the future. Equally, other young players will want to come to the club and not just necessarily on loan either.

I look at Middlesbrough, and wonder if they would be as strong as they have been this season without Bamford, Fredericks, Omeruo, Vossen and now Kalas too I think? I know Karanka has good links with Mourinho and others within the game but I don't feel that having Kenny Jackett as our manager makes us any less a good opportunity for talented young players. Brentford and Derby are benefitting from loan players too giving them more options to choose from, while Boruc has been great for Bournemouth.

Bournemouth - Boruc

Middlesbrough - Omeruo, Fredericks, Kalas, Vossen, Bamford

Derby - Ince, Lingard, Mascarell, Bent (Also had Shotton who has since signed permanently)

Ipswich - Williams (Also had Noel Hunt who has since signed permanently)

Watford - No idea who in their squad is their's and who is on loan...

Norwich - No one as far as I can see, managed to keep a lot of players following relegation

Brentford - Pritchard, Toral, Long, Betinho.

Us - Sagbo, Graham. (Jordan Graham too who has since been made permanent).

I just wonder if we could have strengthened just a little more, and not at a lot of cost, and given ourselves more of a chance to push properly for the play offs at least. Is it something that we should be looking at, or is the policy fine as it is? The only loans we have brought in have been when Dicko was injured and we were left with Clarke and McAlinden.

Great post. It is about moving with changing times and with the huge new money deal on the table agents are already starting to think about bigger pay days. The fact is that only about 6 clubs in the country are capable of winning the premier league and we are not one and wont be until sheik Yamoney buys us.Bamford and Bent are 2 examples of loans that could help get a team into the money bags league which is where we want and need to be. My beef has always been hat I hate being a struggling premier team more than a good championship team so vis a vis I prefer us in the championship until we are capable of really staying up rather than a constant dogfight. We didnt do enough business in the last window IMO and I hope for a couple of quality loans to help us challenge

 

[Deleted Cyber]

I don't like the idea of signing someone on loan with no chance of it becoming permanent but there must be viable options around who could improve our midfield in particular.

Completely disagree here. Squads are what 25-30 strong in the prem and if you are not getting a game a drop down shows what you can do, allows you to develop and puts you in the shop window not to mention strengthens the lower div team. Bamford will go back to chelsea but what if Boro win the league? It then gives him real food for thought. Play in the prem with Boro and sign full time or play also ran with a top 6 squad? Loans are the only way to help close the huge gap between top prem and the rest

 

[Deleted Cyber]

Point still stands, why linger in this league with substantial income drop on the horizon?

Next year might see 2 teams run away with the automatic places from day 1 and make promotion immediately more difficult to achieve than it looks this season.

I fear Wolves may be to principled and could well be their own worst enemy on this point.

with this last window Failing to prepare is preparing to fail Afobe aside. I know its a cliche but it fits our squad which does lack the depth and quality to really dent the top six. Seems like a missed chance to me. A couple of injuries or suspensions and we struggle

 

[Norman Deeley]

Think you're absolutely spot on, YW - ditto Markajim. Couple of good loans could have made all the difference this season. Instead we had Sagbo and Danny Graham...

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

You could say that illustrates the folly behind thinking that loaning players will automatically improve us and get us in the top six. Both those players should have had a decent impact here. They didn't.

 

[YoungWolf]

You could say that illustrates the folly behind thinking that loaning players will automatically improve us and get us in the top six. Both those players should have had a decent impact here. They didn't.

I think that's why we might be a bit hesitant to loan out players who aren't playing in the division above. However, both loans were emergency ones and both hadn't scored well for a long time before joining us

 

[MARKakaJIM]

You could say that illustrates the folly behind thinking that loaning players will automatically improve us and get us in the top six. Both those players should have had a decent impact here. They didn't.

They'd only have made an impact if Jackett changed the system to suit them, the side is massively reliant on pace up top to get in behind teams, neither of those signings offered that and thus proved to be as useless as no-pace Clarke.

 

[Johnny75]

I largely agree with you YW and Mark. I think we have a clear disconnect between identification of talent to bring in and style of play. Graham and Sagbo should have been the target man/ powerful forward KJ wanted in the summer. Neither worked out as our squad is not good enough to play with either two midfielders alone or with one striker who is largely immobile.

The only players that would work on loan are two central midfielders that are used to playing in central midfield as a pair and at 4-4-2 and that means changing to 4-4-2. Or KJ could do what has worked so well before now and get a proper ball playing 10 in and change to the system he had last season.

Largely this is down to the manager changing to a system which is not suiting his midfield players not any new loan players we may get.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Only one player contracted to Derby, Jeff Hendrick, has contributed to their past 10 goals. Ince and Bent have scored the remainder but there are other young temporary acquisitions who have played a sizeable part in their promotion surge.

Jesse Lingard, brought in on the final day of the January transfer window until the end of the season, made an impact by providing the assist for Bent at Rotherham. Real Madrid’s Omar Mascarell has added poise in midfield, while Jordon Ibe was so impressive in his brief spell Liverpool recalled him and will now offer him a lucrative contract.

Would that kind of stat bother anyone if it were happening here? I really wouldn't want us to be stacked with temporary players, it does nothing for our identity. I know promotion has to take precedence over most things but I want Wolves players scoring goals for Wolves. A loan here and there is fine but not a load of them carrying the team.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

Would you take it for 1 season to earn promotion and then build a better, more permanent team with the PL money?