Summer 2021 transfer window

[Deutsch Wolf]

Their return is when they sell us. The club is obviously worth way more than the £30m they paid to acquire us, though of course they have since invested further funds and we're not in a position to repay that. Skimming money off the top of transfer fees wouldn't work for them.

The question is who would actually be interested.

 

[The Saturday Boy]

I don't even think their intention is to sell us for financial gain - having a Premier League football club in your portfolio carries prestige, the more successful the club the more prestige. Winning the Premier League or a Domestic Cup even getting into Europe won't make Fosun any richer but it does reflect well on them and it will definitely help them in their own domestic market (which is quite large).

Fosun don't care about us, their interest is developing a brand based on the football club - and the brand is enhanced if it is successful. Our joy at that success or our misery if it doesn't go well is probably not at the top of their priorities.

 

[AndyWolves]

Their return is when they sell us. The club is obviously worth way more than the £30m they paid to acquire us, though of course they have since invested further funds and we're not in a position to repay that. Skimming money off the top of transfer fees wouldn't work for them.

The question is who would actually be interested.

I don't even think it's that. Fosun will want to work with partners, it's about increasing brand awareness and visibility.

I hadn't heard of GazProm until they started getting into football, I reckon the same is true of Fosun for lots of people.

I don't think Fosun bought wolves to make a return, I think they bought wolves so they could get their name out there.

 

[PuntsWolf]

It’s a great plan. But there’s not much of a global appetite for the brand of middling football clubs.

Wolves finishing 8th-14th is not going to grow the brand. What grows the brand is on field performance which is directly correlated with financial investment.

They might not want to sell us, but they know where we are at now they would turn a profit if they did. Putting more money in might not make us any better (everton), but will eat into that profit.

 

[Deano]

It’s a great plan. But there’s not much of a global appetite for the brand of middling football clubs.

Wolves finishing 8th-14th is not going to grow the brand. What grows the brand is on field performance which is directly correlated with financial investment.

They might not want to sell us, but they know where we are at now they would turn a profit if they did. Putting more money in might not make us any better (everton), but will eat into that profit.

Agree.

Any club that has different spokes to "the brand" have them as a byproduct of on field success.

Fosun are trying to artificially manufacture the brand and I am more than skeptical that it will work.

To do what they want requires continuous large investment and they are showing all the signs of not being willing to do it.

Mid table seasons all the time becomes very tiresome very quickly.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

And if the upper limit of your realistic ambitions is mid-table every year, it doesn't take too much to go wrong before you're battling relegation.

Newcastle are always on the precipice because they never have any ambition to finish higher than about halfway at best.

 

[WolfMan]

Am I missing something here? This is our net spend since we got promoted. According to this it's the fourth highest and higher than Man City, Chelsea, Leicester and Liverpool's.

So surely we must be at the limit of FFP, if our net spend is higher than City's and they have broken it? Or is this website bullshit?

If not it doesn't look like Fosun are just happy with mid-table to me.

 

[PuntsWolf]

Am I missing something here? This is our net spend since we got promoted. According to this it's the fourth highest and higher than Man City, Chelsea, Leicester and Liverpool's.

So surely we must be at the limit of FFP, if our net spend is higher than City's and they have broken it? Or is this website bullshit?

If not it doesn't look like Fosun are just happy with mid-table to me.

There’s more to FFP than transfer spend. It’s profit as a business.

We should have more room to operate in transfer fees as based on the last accounts our wage bill is £60m less than Leicester’s. So if all other non transfer related finances being equal with Leicester, we should have £60m more to spend in the transfer market than them in that particular season but out bottom lines for FFP purposes would be the same.

 

[WolfMan]

There’s more to FFP than transfer spend. It’s profit as a business.

We should have more room to operate in transfer fees as based on the last accounts our wage bill is £60m less than Leicester’s. So if all other non transfer related finances being equal with Leicester, we should have £60m more to spend in the transfer market than them in that particular season but out bottom lines for FFP purposes would be the same.

But hypothetically if we were to spend that £60m on one player, we wouldn't then be able to pay them any wages?

 

[PuntsWolf]

But hypothetically if we were to spend that £60m on one player, we wouldn't then be able to pay them any wages?

Well yes if you want to be pedantic. Was purely making the point that net spend isn’t the be all and end all.

£55m then and 100k p/w for that player.

 

[WolfMan]

Well yes if you want to be pedantic. Was purely making the point that net spend isn’t the be all and end all.

£55m then and 100k p/w for that player.

I wasn't being pedantic, it was a genuine question. Thanks for explaining it.

 

[AndyWolves]

It’s a great plan. But there’s not much of a global appetite for the brand of middling football clubs.

Wolves finishing 8th-14th is not going to grow the brand. What grows the brand is on field performance which is directly correlated with financial investment.

They might not want to sell us, but they know where we are at now they would turn a profit if they did. Putting more money in might not make us any better (everton), but will eat into that profit.

If that's the case then surely Fosun would be looking to exit asap?

If wolves staying in a status quo won't grow the brand any more and any progression would eat into their profits then surely their time here is done?

 

[AndyWolves]

There’s more to FFP than transfer spend. It’s profit as a business.

We should have more room to operate in transfer fees as based on the last accounts our wage bill is £60m less than Leicester’s. So if all other non transfer related finances being equal with Leicester, we should have £60m more to spend in the transfer market than them in that particular season but out bottom lines for FFP purposes would be the same.

We aren't under the same FFP rules as Leicester though so it's a moot point.

 

[PuntsWolf]

If that's the case then surely Fosun would be looking to exit asap?

If wolves staying in a status quo won't grow the brand any more and any progression would eat into their profits then surely their time here is done?

I don’t know what there plan is. But what it appears it is doesn’t make any sense to me. Hence my moaning on here

We aren't under the same FFP rules as Leicester though so it's a moot point.

No we aren’t, but it was purely to illustrate that net spend isn’t the sole factor in FFP.

We’ve been told we can’t make a loss for a few years by UEFA (if its even being enforced, or can be enforced if we don’t qualify). We aren’t making one (nowhere near), I don’t understand why people think we are.

 

[The Saturday Boy]

Fosun's investment was intended to be infrastructure to create more revenue. A couple of months back, Jeff Shi suggested the initial 10 year plan might end up being a 20 year plan. Fosun probably wanted to build a brand new stadium out of town with potential to expand into other areas to generate more revenue which would have enabled the playing side to expand on it's own. A larger stadium with increased attendances and a site that is multi purpose (hotel, casino, conferences etc) is easier to achieve outside Wolverhampton than at Molineux.

There is a dilemma for Fosun now - with the possibility of an increased capacity stadium a few years away, they have to maintain the club in the Premier League and that may mean using money that was originally earmarked for infrastructure on the playing staff but if they do that then there is a limit on how much they can put into the club. It really isn't the case that Fosun could just dump £100 million in the transfer kitty without that having a consequence elsewhere.

 

[AndyWolves]

I don’t know what there plan is. But what it appears it is doesn’t make any sense to me. Hence my moaning on here

No we aren’t, but it was purely to illustrate that net spend isn’t the sole factor in FFP.

We’ve been told we can’t make a loss for a few years by UEFA (if its even being enforced, or can be enforced if we don’t qualify). We aren’t making one (nowhere near), I don’t understand why people think we are.

Maybe there is a plan then that's something other than what you think it is. I think that the days of thinking football clubs make their money from ticket sales and shirts are behind us, things like brand exposure and "telling stories with partners" seem to be where our chiefs are focused. (Obvs TV money is still king here).

The Evil genius tie up suggests to me that Fosun are keen to keep an interest in us and promote our brand further, whatever that looks like.

We aren't making a loss and do have wiggle room, we'll see what happens between now and the end of the window. I would say that next summer we are definitely clear of FFP rulings and have loads of headroom given our financial performance recently.

 

[Deano]

Maybe there is a plan then that's something other than what you think it is. I think that the days of thinking football clubs make their money from ticket sales and shirts are behind us, things like brand exposure and "telling stories with partners" seem to be where our chiefs are focused. (Obvs TV money is still king here).

The Evil genius tie up suggests to me that Fosun are keen to keep an interest in us and promote our brand further, whatever that looks like.

We aren't making a loss and do have wiggle room, we'll see what happens between now and the end of the window. I would say that next summer we are definitely clear of FFP rulings and have loads of headroom given our financial performance recently.

What is the path from teaming up with Evil Genius that sees money generated from eSports put back in and spent on the first team or anything related to first team players.

I am genuinely interested because I don't know the answer and I have seen plenty of people on social media post comments such as "how can people not see what Wolves are trying to do with eSports and how it will mean we can spend more " yet I bet those people couldn't explain it if you asked them.

 

[AndyWolves]

What is the path from teaming up with Evil Genius that sees money generated from eSports put back in and spent on the first team or anything related to first team players.

I am genuinely interested because I don't know the answer and I have seen plenty of people on social media post comments such as "how can people not see what Wolves are trying to do with eSports and how it will mean we can spend more " yet I bet those people couldn't explain it if you asked them.

Its all about exposure and sponsorship.

Marketing folk look to get their products exposed to as many people as possible, the more people who see your product the more you pay.

When wolves do things like eSports, EvilGenius that kind of thing it improves the attractiveness of the wolves brand to marketers because wolves aren't only in the middle aged football fan demographic, they're now also in the younger eSports demographic.

So, when companies look at who they should sponsor, do they pick wolves who also reach a completely demographic in eSports and are massive in Mexico or do you choose another club who don't have those varied demographics.

This then leads to greater revenue streams coming into the club and help us generate more income to reinvest into the club in whatever we see fit.

 

[WolfMan]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1422925282483347456

So Lage is expecting some more signings at least.

 

[Deano]

Its all about exposure and sponsorship.

Marketing folk look to get their products exposed to as many people as possible, the more people who see your product the more you pay.

When wolves do things like eSports, EvilGenius that kind of thing it improves the attractiveness of the wolves brand to marketers because wolves aren't only in the middle aged football fan demographic, they're now also in the younger eSports demographic.

So, when companies look at who they should sponsor, do you pick wolves who also reach a completely demographic in eSports and are massive in Mexico or do you choose another club who don't have those varied demographics.

This then leads to greater revenue streams coming into the club and help us generate more income to reinvent into the club in whatever we see fit.

I get that eSports is a massive industry and getting bigger but it is a very crowded market.

As we speak Wolves eSports account on Twitter has 12,000 followers which is very small fry. This means that the eSports arm itself needs a hell of a lot of investment into the eSports part of "the brand" to grow to a point where it has any kind of significant platform to make it generate any decent amount of money and make it attractive to sponsors.

Surely with that in mind anything it generates and possibly more will need to be spent on itself for the foreseeable future. I think we are a long long way off any revenue generated by eSports benefiting the team.

Also we aren't "massive in Mexico" Raul Jimenez is, when he is gone there will be very minimal interest retained in Wolves in Mexico unless we start getting success on the pitch.