Refereeing question

[Langers]

Well done to Howard Webb tonight - thought he did really well, and made some very sensible decisions.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Absolutely excellent refereeing performance. If England don't make the final he looks a certainty.

 

[FrankMunro-371]

Well done to Howard Webb tonight - thought he did really well, and made some very sensible decisions.

Absolutely. He had a great game, and he could easily have sent off the Czech player in the last minute, but used common sense.

 

[Freddeno]

he is like the english version of Collina..

 

[FrankMunro-371]

Absolutely excellent refereeing performance. If England don't make the final he looks a certainty.

If England beat Italy, all English officials will be released from their Euro2012 commitments.

 

[lemonjelly]

Echo these comments.

By the way, has anyone read Collina's The Rules Of The Game? Excellent book I felt. Mandatory reading for non refs - you learn a lot.

*must update the jolly good read thread...*

 

[lemonjelly]

A player may be in an offside position, but because he did not play the ball, the assistant rightly kept his flag down, and when the goal was scored it was another phase of play. That is the interpretation, but I am not saying I agree with it.

If the ball hits the woodwork or rebounds off the keeper then it is deemed that it is in the same phase of play.

Things were a lot simpler a few years back, but that is how the law makers say we must proceed.

In addition, can it reasonably be argued Navas was not interfering with play? Were he not there, perhaps the keeper would have come flying out directly at Iniesta, narrowing the angle with the intention of challenging for the ball? With the position Navas was in, the keeper is less inclined to commit as he will be aware of the option of the pass & doesn't want to gift an open goal opportunity?

Frank, I appreciate the answer you've given, but given that both players were on the edge of the 6 yard box when the ball was played through, why is Navas not interfering with play as per my previous query?

 

[Langers]

Absolutely. He had a great game, and he could easily have sent off the Czech player in the last minute, but used common sense.

From a PTG point of view, that was the best decision he made!!

He also played some really good advantages - one in particular when a Portuguese midfielder went on a mazy run and was fouled a few times, but Webb waited until he actually went down before giving the foul (and unlike other Portuguese players, he actually tried to stay on his feet).

I hate seeing cheap cards brandished every 2 minutes so thought he did very well indeed.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

You hardly noticed Howard Webb tonight.

That is the best commendation that a referee can ever be given in my opinion

 

[FrankMunro-371]

Frank, I appreciate the answer you've given, but given that both players were on the edge of the 6 yard box when the ball was played through, why is Navas not interfering with play as per my previous query?

I would think he was not given offside because he did not play the ball, and also he was not interfering with the goalkeepers vision. Had the assistant raised his flag, I doubt many would have objected, though technically he was correct.

 

[Sniffer]

Hi Frank

I ran the line in a junior fixture on Saturday morning. I was asked by the ref to delay putting the flag up for offside decisions to ensure that the player who was in the offside position actually went onto receive the ball or was interfering in play. Several times in the first half (which was odd as I was one of only two people on the line in that half) I was barracked by the opposing teams followers for decisions that I gave and this continued into the second half. At one point the ref had to speak to the barrackers who then, to be fair to them gave no further problems for the rest of the game. However later in the game the opposing teams manager took umbridge to a decision that I gave (he was about 15 yards away from being in line with it) and threw a tantrum on the sideline. He accused me of cheating, stated that if thats how you want to play the game you can stick it, and despite assurances from one of our own coaches who was in line with the decision and who stated it was a correct one, he continued to rant and rave on the sideline. My son's side were already 4-0 down and a couple of minutes later they conceeded a fifth goal at which point the ref stopped the game as the oppositions coach had still not calmed down. He asked me to stand down as linesman, stating that he was not accusing me of making any incorrect decisions or of cheating however in the interest of calming the situaton down it would be better if one of our teams coaches did the job. I wasn't happy with the ref to be honest as despite his assurances that I had done nothing wrong, it didn't look that way to the rest of the people in attendance at the game. The ref stated after the game that he will report the incidents in his report and report the opposing teams manager. My questions are therefore as follows:-

1) Was the referee correct in dismissing me as a linesman to calm the situation down?
2) What are your own views on the touching of the ball or interfering with play rule,especially in parks football, given the problems that this causes.

Cheers,
Sniffer

 

[FrankMunro-371]

Sniffer, When the opponents coach approached you and started ranting, I wonder how long it was before the referee realised the situation that was developing, because he should have gone over to the coach and told him to move away from the line that you were patrolling. From your report into what happened, it is clear that the referee let you down badly. He should have backed you up, as you were assisting him. It is pointless reporting the opposing coach if he did not take action at the time. He has left himself wide open for an appeal. If I was you, I would bring the incident to the attention of the Referee's Secretary of the league in which your son's team play in.

Offside causes more arguments than anything else, particularly at local level where there are not official assistants appointed. The referee was right to ask you to hold the flag until you knew who was receiving it. The change to law was brought in to stop assistants flagging a player offside who was not interfering with play. It can get confusing when first and second phases of play are brought into consideration, but my advice for assistants is simple. Hold the flag until the player receives the ball or is directly interfering with play. For example, being in the goalkeepers line of visiion. The only time I would ask for an early flag is if a player is chasing the ball as it goes towards the goalkeeper. Stop the game early to prevent a risk of injury due to a collision.
I hope that clarifies things a little.

 

[Kenny]

Sniffer, When the opponents coach approached you and started ranting, I wonder how long it was before the referee realised the situation that was developing, because he should have gone over to the coach and told him to move away from the line that you were patrolling. From your report into what happened, it is clear that the referee let you down badly. He should have backed you up, as you were assisting him. It is pointless reporting the opposing coach if he did not take action at the time. He has left himself wide open for an appeal. If I was you, I would bring the incident to the attention of the Referee's Secretary of the league in which your son's team play in.

Offside causes more arguments than anything else, particularly at local level where there are not official assistants appointed. The referee was right to ask you to hold the flag until you knew who was receiving it. The change to law was brought in to stop assistants flagging a player offside who was not interfering with play. It can get confusing when first and second phases of play are brought into consideration, but my advice for assistants is simple. Hold the flag until the player receives the ball or is directly interfering with play. For example, being in the goalkeepers line of visiion. The only time I would ask for an early flag is if a player is chasing the ball as it goes towards the goalkeeper. Stop the game early to prevent a risk of injury due to a collision.
I hope that clarifies things a little.

So to sum up...The ref is shit?

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

We had a nice ref in micro's game on Sunday (a 7-6 humdinger that should have been first up on MOTD2 (BOOOOOO BBC for ignoring the grass roots). Really reffed the game pretty well, but he played 2.5 minutes of added time in a 20 minute half when we were hanging on at 6-6 and then blew up within a second of the winner being scored. There were no injuries so it was a bizarre amount of Fergie time (only stoppage was a mass substitution by each side and a brief pause to tie our defender's laces).

Oh well. Cracking game though.

 

[Kenny]

a brief pause to tie our defender's laces

.

Ronald Zubar plays in the same team as Micro Squeeze?

 

[FrankMunro-371]

So to sum up...The ref is shit?

No, I am not saying that. He may have had a very good game, but he acted incorrectly in his handling of the specific situation that was mentioned.

 

[Kenny]

Shit then...

 

[James]

The referee should back up his officials and sent that manager to the stands or well to the oposite end of the field. Abuse of the linesmen should not be tolerated

 

[FrankMunro-371]

We had a nice ref in micro's game on Sunday (a 7-6 humdinger that should have been first up on MOTD2 (BOOOOOO BBC for ignoring the grass roots). Really reffed the game pretty well, but he played 2.5 minutes of added time in a 20 minute half when we were hanging on at 6-6 and then blew up within a second of the winner being scored. There were no injuries so it was a bizarre amount of Fergie time (only stoppage was a mass substitution by each side and a brief pause to tie our defender's laces).

Oh well. Cracking game though.

Referees should add on thirty seconds for each substitution. So I wonder how long it took for the mass substitutions to take place. As a matter of interest Paddy, do they have rolling substitutions in their league?

 

[James]

Frank. In regards to kids games the 30 second rule is quite loose and most teams do use rolling subs. I'd say on average in the kids games. 3 mins is the normal for added on time