The NFL Thread

[Paddingtonwolf]

I'm not suggesting that they should have, just that given the talent available last year, missing out on one of those and then having to sack the guy they took instead is a huge miss. Hence it was a shocker.

Edit, he'd been travelling at 156mph

He wasn’t travelling at 156mph pissed the day before the draft though was he? I’m not sure how that level of cuntery can be predicted.

 

[Tony Towner]

OK, I'm clearly not expressing myself properly so I'm out

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Quite clearly not. I’m bemused by your strop but go for it.

 

[Alan]

Think Tony’s point is that a bust is a bust, no matter the reasons why. He’s not really off base in saying that, IMO.

 

[Tony Towner]

Quite clearly not. I’m bemused by your strop but go for it.

Well firstly I'm not stropping I have no investment in the Raiders, but I'll make it simple for you.
The 2020 draft was seen as the best ever for wide receivers depth wise
A season and a half in, that appears to have been an accurate assessment
The Raiders had the first choice of all those receivers
18 months later he's out of the league.
That's a shocking result for them.

 

[big mean bunny]

Yeah I get your point but you are mixing up two things. It's very bad luck, it's not a shocking result from the Raiders in terms of an error on their behalf. Ruggs wasn't a Ryan Leaf level over reach. He was a top half of the draft talent still.

Interestingly as a tangent, Raiders got flack for drafting Lynn Bowden Jnr and then trading him for a lower pick before the end of camp, but some of the area writers at the time had commented the Raiders weren't thrilled by Bowden's attitude and that he was becoming close to Ruggs and hinted he was a bad influence.

Worried this is it for the Raiders now thought. Hosed without Ruggs ability.

 

[Tony Towner]

I

Yeah I get your point but you are mixing up two things. It's very bad luck, it's not a shocking result from the Raiders in terms of an error on their behalf. Ruggs wasn't a Ryan Leaf level over reach. He was a top half of the draft talent still.

I didn't say it was I said it looked poor decision making, which in terms of being the best WR available it was. Now if you are purely looking to draft a vertical threat then it's fine, but I'm not sure you do that so high up. In terms of mistake it's not close to Philly taking Reagor over Jefferson.

As an aside I bet the Raiders sign Jackson until the end of the season

 

[big mean bunny]

Raiders were desperate for a vertical threat though and even with his poor statistical year as a rookie Ruggs was having some form of impact. A different thing but I hate the 'that player will be there later' thinking as you don't have a draft pick later! and the people saying that are often the same people who had Tua as a sure thing, said that this years QBs were going to be seriously talented and day one starts (nearly all have massively struggled). At the time people were saying that the Raiders shouldn't have passed on Jeudy, now that's being changed to Lamb and Jefferson. Even on just a quick search found a lot of mock drafts that had Ruggs as the 2nd WR off the board and ahead of Lamb in some places.

 

[Tony Towner]

Concensus was Lamb, Jeudy, Ruggs, Jefferson but you are correct different analysts saw it different ways. Draft wise it went Ruggs, Jeudy, Lamb, Reagor, Jefferson. Jeudy has been injured a lot, Ruggs we know, Reagor will be a number 2 at best, whilst a lot of the 2nd round guys have done really well.

 

[Alan]

One thing to note, Tony. The Raiders are infamous for weighting a player’s speed much more heavily than other teams. Ruggs was the quickest receiver in the draft that year so people who know the Raiders weren’t surprised by the mild reach.

The Davis family loves speed. They see it as an uncoachable attribute that should be valued more than almost anything else.

Ruggs isn’t the first receiver they’ve drafted based on pace, and it usually burns them. They keep doing it, though, and if Ruggs hadn’t made such a colossally stupid mistake, it finally would have panned out in their favor.

Apologies if this comes off as condescending, I don’t mean it to be.

 

[Tony Towner]

Not at all Alan, I wouldn't claim to be particularly knowledgeable about college football or the Raiders. I think I've pitched it before as I'm knowledgeable about other people's opinions, principally from podcasts. It doesn't mean they are right though. Philly would be a bit different, touchwood will be there for the nothing game against Washington, just before Xmas

 

[Alan]

They're forever chasing the ghost of Jerry Rice. Tough job finding a replacement for perhaps the best WR to ever play. Which would be why it's been 20 years and they still haven't been able to do it.

 

[big mean bunny]

The speed part is why the Raiders valued Ruggs so highly, he ran a 4.27, my memory is both Lamb and Jeudy were late 4.49s or mid 4.50s, that's a huge difference in terms of looking for speed from a player. Really like what I have seen of Jeudy, especially given the QBs he has been with so far.

 

[Jabbawolf]

We have someone who plays wide, and is extremely fast and possibly available…..

 

[Dire Wolf]

Complete hindsight with Jefferson though as at the time no one was saying he was should be the no1 WR. Ruggs had started to really develop this year and his speed has won games. Other than Jefferson he is still looking like the WR Raiders game needed. Of the WR class from last year he isn't a shocker in anyway except for this recent news, and 'by the way are you planning or killing someone in the near future?' wasn't in the thinking when they drafted him, specifically given the Raiders are as high on character picks as anyone of recent years! Some of the below had better rookie years but haven't looked better this year to me.

Ruggs
Jeudy
Lamb
Regaor
Aiyuk
Higgins
Pittman
Shenault
Hamler
Claypool
Van Jefferson
Mims

Gabriel Davis missing off this list. Should be a consideration for the top 6, he had 7 TDs last year and is a really excellent route runner.

 

[big mean bunny]

He isn't missing. It was a list of WR taken in rounds 1 or 2 although appreciate I didn't specify that. Anything after round 2 is even less likely to work out so teams are given a lot more free passes when those picks aren't the best.

I'd wait and see with Davis as he wouldn't be near my top 6. Similarly to Aiyuk and Shenault who showed real flashes of talent last year but have massively regressed this year in comparison stats and targets wise.

 

[big mean bunny]

When I say no where near, I actually mean not in the top 6 as I'd put him 8th-10th having given it an actual thought. And that is pretty near!

 

[Dire Wolf]

When I say no where near, I actually mean not in the top 6 as I'd put him 8th-10th having given it an actual thought. And that is pretty near!

To be fair he suffers from being on the same team as Steffon Diggs, Cole Beasley and Emmanuel Sanders! He doesn't get as many targets but when he does he always makes the catch. Very reliable. On many other teams he'd be vying for the number 1/2 receiver role.

 

[Donegal Wolf]

OBJ getting cut by the Browns.

Doesn't want to be there, the video during the released by his father didn't help.
Browns not clicking quite right this year

 

[Alan]

Browns in self-destruction shocker.

I feel for Clevelanders. Just no luck, ever.