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Israel-Palestine

EpsomWolf said:
I think protestors generally have been increasingly effective and troublesome to the authorities and no government is going to sit back and allow the sort of disruption and chaos being caused irrespective of whether it falls between the gaps of legitimate right to protest, criminal damage or terrorism.

People are passionate about their causes and are quick to downplay any negative impact on others as ‘a bit of inconvenience’, but tbh blocking roads, airports, any type of infrastructure, or anything that stops anyone going about their lawful business spills beyond legitimate protest and needs robust legislation which is ultimately effective.

Protestors seem to want to have their cake and eat it but to some extent we’re all becoming victims of their success.
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Such legislation has been passed. It still doesn't make it terrorism.
 
I’m guessing whatever legislation was passed is fucking useless then and the terrorism label is required to achieve the desired outcome.
 
EpsomWolf said:
I think protestors generally have been increasingly effective and troublesome to the authorities and no government is going to sit back and allow the sort of disruption and chaos being caused irrespective of whether it falls between the gaps of legitimate right to protest, criminal damage or terrorism.

People are passionate about their causes and are quick to downplay any negative impact on others as ‘a bit of inconvenience’, but tbh blocking roads, airports, any type of infrastructure, or anything that stops anyone going about their lawful business spills beyond legitimate protest and needs robust legislation which is ultimately effective.

Protestors seem to want to have their cake and eat it but to some extent we’re all becoming victims of their success.
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Isn’t the problem here defining what is legitimate protest? History is full of examples of protest that has inconvenienced others in defiance of the law which has then led to profound change. It was lawful for people to be segregated by virtue of their race in a number of countries in the 20th Century and standing outside a Town Hall with a placard was unlikely to be effective. The response of those Governments was not to sit back and allow it, they doubled down but they were on the wrong side of history.

Sometimes, a legitimate protest requires action that prevents people going about their lawful business to be effective. History tells us that. Wearing badges is not enough in days like these…
 
The Saturday Boy said:
Isn’t the problem here defining what is legitimate protest? History is full of examples of protest that has inconvenienced others in defiance of the law which has then led to profound change. It was lawful for people to be segregated by virtue of their race in a number of countries in the 20th Century and standing outside a Town Hall with a placard was unlikely to be effective. The response of those Governments was not to sit back and allow it, they doubled down but they were on the wrong side of history.

Sometimes, a legitimate protest requires action that prevents people going about their lawful business to be effective. History tells us that. Wearing badges is not enough in days like these…
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I agree entirely, however am also much less forgiving on the impact on others and think the actions in many cases are spilling into unacceptable actions that need dealing with.

The likes of JSO orgasming with excitement at their effectiveness or idiots spraying red paint and so on took their eye off the ball and have a role to play in new, and, abuse of existing legislation.

Not condoning it but am certainly sympathetic. It was all predicted by many at the time and it’s naive to want or expect any government on the back foot to play with a straight bat.
 
Paddingtonwolf said:
You invoke terrorism legislation to deal with legitimate protest and you are an authoritarian state.
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Well, I think we’re getting to the nitty gritty there. There are some very vocal individuals left and right whose views we might not agree with but have chosen to conveniently ignore when it has suited us who have been calling that out for a long time.

Interesting to learn Croydon is about to go live with the UK’s first permanent Facial Recognition Cameras. Not difficult to imagine they’ll be on every street corner eventually and I wouldn’t be surprised to see a move to ban face coverings next.

Regardless of the drivers I don’t think there’s any turning back now.
 
This side of a Reform government that face coverings ban won't come.

Although I should point out that if you fill up your bike with fuel you are supposed to remove your helmet before entering the shop (smile you are on candid camera) to pay, and it has been that way for over 35 years.
 
Paddingtonwolf said:
This side of a Reform government that face coverings ban won't come.

Although I should point out that if you fill up your bike with fuel you are supposed to remove your helmet before entering the shop (smile you are on candid camera) to pay, and it has been that way for over 35 years.
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That has been somewhat relaxed these days.

Visor up is fine and we only tell our colleagues to ask for removal if they're buying cigs/alcohol and we need to assess age.
 
Brize Norton attack is going to cost at least £25 million with a possibility of reaching £50 million, it’s been announced today, one engine has been stripped and declared beyond economic repair ie scrap, other engine being checked, it then says other airfield infrastructure needs repair after the incident as well
 
Keef said:
Brize Norton attack is going to cost at least £25 million with a possibility of reaching £50 million, it’s been announced today, one engine has been stripped and declared beyond economic repair ie scrap, other engine being checked, it then says other airfield infrastructure needs repair after the incident as well
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Perhaps they could ask Baroness Mone for a refund?
 
Just read 43% of oil china imports comes through the strait of hormuz. If Iran blocks it every will suffer higher oil prices but China potentially get hurt the most
 
AndyWolves said:
Just read 43% of oil china imports comes through the strait of hormuz. If Iran blocks it every will suffer higher oil prices but China potentially get hurt the most
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And given the much oil is going to be used in or for their exported manufacturing, that pain will be passed on
 
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