Trump

[Elephant Pyjamas]

I would suggest that your views are part of the 'problems that lead to violence like this'.

How so?

 

[Wolftone]

14 convictions in 14 years and still walking around free with a knife.
The state and justice system failed every law abiding citizen.

 

[WVWolf]

How so?

Being glad that someone has been killed. I feel that is a pretty extreme view.

I don't know enough about Kirk to debate him properly, so I won't pretend I do. But it's not that relevant to the point.

Killing someone because you don't agree with them should never be justified. And whilst you (not saying you do, btw), Alan and others may feel it's okay because of Kirk's views and actions, many agreed with him.

If a prominent figure on the left was killed, this logic would suggest it can also be justified, because some people would have the same view as Alan that the dead person was scum, just on the opposite side.

He also referenced Kirk causing harm to people as a reason for being glad he was dead. Again, how far does this stretch?

So, I think it's a very dangerous road to go down.

 

[darlowolf64]

"Someone on the left" would be wanting social care for all, tax the rich and feed the poor (for example) they wouldn't be espousing a variety of controversial views, especially regarding an opposition to gun control, abortion and LGBTQ rights; criticism of the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and Martin Luther King Jr.; promotion of Christian nationalism, COVID-19 misinformation, the Great Replacement conspiracy theory, and false claims of electoral fraud in 2020, so it's a false equivalence.

• Denver, Colorado (September 11, 2025): A shooting at a Denver-area high school left the community shaken.
• Minneapolis, Minnesota (August 27, 2025): A man opened fire at Annunciation Catholic Church, which includes an elementary school. He killed two children and injured 17 others, 18 of whom were children, before taking his own life.
• Dallas, Texas (April 15, 2025): At Wilmer-Hutchins High School, a 17-year-old student shot and wounded four other male students before fleeing.
• Baltimore, Maryland (March 4, 2025): A 16-year-old student was fatally shot at close range outside Lansdowne High School after being chased from a nearby shopping center.

Oh, thoughts and prayers then forgotten...
In June, Minnesota state representative Melissa Hortman and her husband were shot dead in their home.

John Hoffman, a state senator also for Minnesota, and his wife were also shot in their home but survived.

Both politicians were members of the Minnesota Democratic-Farmer-Labor Party.
1 right wing friend of the President is shot and all hell breaks loose... There is no balance

 

[Alan]

Where we disagree is that Kirk didn't just have rancid opinions, he had the power to act on them. This is not a case of simple disagreement.

For the third time, Kirk getting shot in the neck in front of hundreds of people is not something I wished upon him, but I can't sit here and pretend that he was just some guy with mundane conservative opinions. Allow me to illustrate why I'm not upset that he can't add his voice to political discourse any longer. This is a man who:

• Called the Civil Rights Act a "mistake" that "led to more crime"
• Referred to trans and LGBTQ+ activism as "one of the most destructive social contagions in human history"
• Blamed mass shootings in the US on "gang violence" or "trans hysteria" (he was, in fact, making exactly this point when he was killed)
• Ran/founded a political organization that keeps a blacklist of university professors that have been labeled "too liberal" (see: professorwatchlist.org)
• Advocated for placing armed guards in schools, as well as the aforementioned statement that gun violence is "worth it" in return for the continued allowance of firearm ownership; "that is a prudent deal which is rational."
• He also advocated for reduced regulations on firearm sales
• Launched a social media campaign attempting to discredit the activism and impact of Martin Luther King Jr.
• Stated that leftists like myself hate America:
  • "[Donald Trump] has revealed [the left]. This is who they have always been. They have always hated this country."
• Stated that if he had a 10 year old daughter who became pregnant as a result of rape, he would force her to carry to term
• Stated that "abortion is never medically necessary"
• On immigration:
  • "We have one culture that you assimilate towards. One."
  • "America was at its peak when we halted immigration for 40 years and we dropped our foreign-born percentage to its lowest level ever."
  • "We have 55 million foreigners in this country... we've got to take a step back and say that you're no longer a nation. You're something else. You're a colony."

No, I will not give him my sympathy.