Live Match Discussion: 2020/21

[Alan]

If VAR isn't going to produce more correct results than not, as a bare minimum, then it ought to be scrapped.

 

[NoodleWolf]

At the start, I was totally on board with VAR. Loved the idea of ruling out those horrible mistakes that can happen if the officials missed something.

Over time, in reality, it has just been awful. Slowly sapped away the excitement. I've found I barely celebrate any Wolves goal these days because I'm just waiting for someone to be 1mm offside, or the ball to have brushed someone's arm in the build-up.

Instead of fixing those really clear and obvious errors - someone getting incorrectly sent off for a fair challenge, or the ref missing a clear and obvious penalty - 9 times outta 10 it is actually just a situation that is detracting from the game. Often some horrible, nitpicky, studs or vague part of the upper arm offside nonsense, or a grey area where interpretation and inconsistency (and incompetence in some cases!) are still at the forefront, like the general mess of how handball is being applied and then looked at by VAR this season. I get that it is difficult, this is a game of fine margins, but the way it is being used is definitely not as it should be.

I went from loving the idea of a review system to rule out horrible injustices, to just fucking hating the entire thing for the amount of joy it sucks out of the game.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

To be honest I thought Watkins was offside there. Looked off. Always does when they get so clearly the wrong side of the centre half.

But it's a pen. Which they then haven't given.

But they got a pen. Which 100% was not a pen.

It isn't eliminating mistakes, which I thought was the aim.

 

[NoodleWolf]

It isn't eliminating mistakes, which I thought was the aim.

Agree, exactly this. It is causing so much frustration and disappointment with the combo of not actually doing its job to fix errors, while also detracting from the game in other ways.

 

[Tony Towner]

When a goal is scored there's a concerted effort to find a reason to rule it out. When something happens in the box there's the same desire to find a penalty. It's not about the game any longer it's controlled by attention seeking sociopaths. Last season they were largely getting what they would see as the correct decisions, but in a forensic manner which went against the spirit and flow of the game. This season, they aren't even doing that.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I think you get far better results if you don't have peers reviewing peers.

Think about it, are you openly going to keep telling a colleague he's wrong in front of everyone at work in real time? Even if they are, you just won't, it's bad optics. So a bad decision gets backed up, or if your man in the box says "change this", the on pitch guy will just agree.

There's no way Kilman vs Leicester is handball. There's no way Adama yesterday is NOT a penalty, let alone a bloody yellow card for diving (good job he's unlikely to ever be troubled by accumulation of cards). And that's not even my bias, I'll happily say when we get the rub of the green and don't call for ridiculous stuff, just objectively they are very bad decisions that have somehow been changed/affirmed by video evidence that proves the exact opposite.

Get people in who are at least distanced from the current set of officials. Ex-players (who have passed the requisite courses, not refereeing all the way up, but just make sure they know all the laws properly), refs who've been away from the game for a while, people who train specifically for this brand new job, whatever.

 

[PuntsWolf]

It wasn’t a penalty on Adama though.

Everyone is so hypocritical. We moan about Salah, Grealish, Mahrez whoever going down and getting a penalty for literally nothing then think the Adama one is too? Two wrongs don’t make a right. Giving penalties for that sort of thing (and expecting them) is exactly what’s wrong with the game.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I don't appreciate being called a hypocrite much so I'd be grateful if you take that back.

I think it is. He beats him on the outside, he steps on his boot, that's been a penalty for years and years and years. Is it enough to make him fall over? Probably not. Not the point though.

 

[sycophantia]

It wasn’t a penalty on Adama though.

Everyone is so hypocritical. We moan about Salah, Grealish, Mahrez whoever going down and getting a penalty for literally nothing then think the Adama one is too? Two wrongs don’t make a right. Giving penalties for that sort of thing (and expecting them) is exactly what’s wrong with the game.

Looked like a dive initially but the first replay showed the defender caught his foot when he was going past at pace...it was a penalty, the kind of mistake var was bought in for but doesn't consistantly get right.....its crap, if they can't use it properly, may as well get rid

 

[NoodleWolf]

It reminded me a lot of the penalty last year against City.

Donk stands on Mahrez's toes, who then exaggerates the fall a bit (a lot, actually, now I've just rewatched the clip - way more than Adama did ) Ref says no, but VAR checks and deems it a penalty. If that one is, then so is the Adama one. In both cases there's very little contact, but technically is enough to award a foul. But VAR again failing in the end with the consistency in two very similar situations.

 

[PuntsWolf]

I don't appreciate being called a hypocrite much so I'd be grateful if you take that back.

I think it is. He beats him on the outside, he steps on his boot, that's been a penalty for years and years and years. Is it enough to make him fall over? Probably not. Not the point though.

Was a general comment about everyone being up in arms about it not being given, yet moan about other penalties been given. Wasn’t aimed at anyone in particular, I’ve been baffled by the sheer volume of it on here.

It looked a dive so the ref didn’t give it, if you then forensically analyse a slow motion replay he may have grazed his toe. This hasn’t been given as penalties ever because you literally can’t see it with the naked eye. It might have become a penalty in this shite VAR world, but that is exactly the problem.

People say “there’s contact so it’s not a dive”, drives me mad. You don’t do down for that anywhere else on the pitch. He felt the touch, then decided to go down as an after thought (like grealish today), so it looked bad and he got booked.

 

[PuntsWolf]

Looked like a dive initially but the first replay showed the defender caught his foot when he was going past at pace...it was a penalty, the kind of mistake var was bought in for but doesn't consistantly get right.....its crap, if they can't use it properly, may as well get rid

That is not what VAR was bought in for.

It reminded me a lot of the penalty last year against City.

Donk stands on Mahrez's toes, who then exaggerates the fall a bit (a lot, actually, now I've just rewatched the clip - way more than Adama did ) Ref says no, but VAR checks and deems it a penalty. If that one is, then so is the Adama one. In both cases there's very little contact, but technically is enough to award a foul. But VAR again failing in the end with the consistency in two very similar situations.

That wasn’t a penalty either (even if the contact was 1000x greater), because he’d overrun the ball so chucked himself to the floor. It’s not the contact, it’s the context of the situation (accidental tread on the foot, didn’t have a play on the ball, didn’t impede him).

Guarantee if I could be arsed to look back there would be a solid number of people saying that wasn’t a pen and but this Traore one was. Neither were pens but that was more of one. But two wrongs don’t make a right

 

[Derby Wolf]

That is not what VAR was bought in for.

That wasn’t a penalty either (even if the contact was 1000x greater), because he’d overrun the ball so chucked himself to the floor. It’s not the contact, it’s the context of the situation (accidental tread on the foot, didn’t have a play on the ball, didn’t impede him).

Guarantee if I could be arsed to look back there would be a solid number of people saying that wasn’t a pen and but this Traore one was. Neither were pens but that was more of one. But two wrongs don’t make a right

Its not hypocritical to point out we get the shit end of the stick v City going against us and Arsenal when it doesn't go for us. Its pointing out the wild inconsistencies that VAR has introduced where we still appear to be getting shafted.

 

[Derby Wolf]

I think you get far better results if you don't have peers reviewing peers.

Think about it, are you openly going to keep telling a colleague he's wrong in front of everyone at work in real time? Even if they are, you just won't, it's bad optics. So a bad decision gets backed up, or if your man in the box says "change this", the on pitch guy will just agree.

Likewise, is David Coote or Bankes really going to whisper in Michael Olivers ear "I think you've made a mistake there Mike" As entertaining as your retort would be it'd be like me with my Germam GCSE trying to tell you to brush up on your grammar


numerous times you've had a junior official (Read: wank) on VAR, as much as we all despise Coote and Bankes they're unlikely going anywhere until I unlock the means to fire them into the sun so they should be boots on the pitch with a senior official mopping up when they invariably fuck it up.

 

[Elephant Pyjamas]

Was a general comment about everyone being up in arms about it not being given, yet moan about other penalties been given. Wasn’t aimed at anyone in particular, I’ve been baffled by the sheer volume of it on here.

It looked a dive so the ref didn’t give it, if you then forensically analyse a slow motion replay he may have grazed his toe. This hasn’t been given as penalties ever because you literally can’t see it with the naked eye. It might have become a penalty in this shite VAR world, but that is exactly the problem.

People say “there’s contact so it’s not a dive”, drives me mad. You don’t do down for that anywhere else on the pitch. He felt the touch, then decided to go down as an after thought (like grealish today), so it looked bad and he got booked.

I think you make a fair point there, pre VAR that would be argued about - "he hasn't done enough for a penalty there", and that was probably right.

Pre VAR it was always accepted that a foul in the box needed to be "worse" than a foul anywhere else on the pitch, because of VAR that has changed now, so you see challenges like the one v West Ham for Liverpool, or the Robertson one against Brighton given as pens, when they never would have been before.

It's obviously much easier to win a penalty now than it used to be, so now that bar has moved lower Adama should be getting a penalty.

It's going to take a while for us all to adapt mentally, as any contact in the box now is a foul, 2 years ago it wasn't.

 

[sycophantia]

I think you make a fair point there, pre VAR that would be argued about - "he hasn't done enough for a penalty there", and that was probably right.

Pre VAR it was always accepted that a foul in the box needed to be "worse" than a foul anywhere else on the pitch, because of VAR that has changed now, so you see challenges like the one v West Ham for Liverpool, or the Robertson one against Brighton given as pens, when they never would have been before.

It's obviously much easier to win a penalty now than it used to be, so now that bar has moved lower Adama should be getting a penalty.

It's going to take a while for us all to adapt mentally, as any contact in the box now is a foul, 2 years ago it wasn't.

my piss is still boiling about the yellow card, not getting the pen is bad enough (it was a pen) but Traore has to be the most honest player in the league when it comes to contact, how often does he break through tackles that are virtually assault and stay on his feet, sometimes its 2 or even 3 in quick succession, then when he's off balance and loses the ball the ref never brings it back for a free kick. Adama has many faults but simulation ain't one of em

 

[Deleted Cyber]

VAR interpretation is the issue. Its been a dogs breakfast by and large , since introduction.

 

[AndyWolves]

The absolute minimum fans want is consistency, and even with VAR that's not happening

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Real Madrid losing to Shakhtar again. Serious risk that they don’t qualify.

 

[James]

Football truly is a funny old game