Diving/Cheating. Ok for Wolves to do?

[Paddingtonwolf]

What we (imho) should be discussing is not a comparison between Dicko and Forestieri, per se, but more whether actions like Dicko's should be acceptable in the modern game. He has gone down very easily, but there is contact and therefore under the current laws Nouha is entitled to head to ground, and the referee is entitled to interpret that as a penalty. That is the way it is now, the question is, should we want it that way? I think we can pontificate about Wolves playing on their feet and being honest but if that isn't getting us points because we miss out on penalties through honesty (think of both Jarvis and Hunt in our premier league stay) then that isn't boxing clever sadly.

Further, to those saying diving is a modern thing in both football and with Wolves, I draw your attention to Kenny Hibbitt's Greg Luganis impression in the 1981 cup semi final.

 

[NoodleWolf]

Here's a poser then. Picture the scene, the play-off final. 89th minute, and the score is 1-1. On balance of play, Wolves fans will feel they've absolutely deserved a win, but haven't quite managed to snag that second goal despite dominating the match and forcing save after save.

Afobe falls to the floor in the area, with an opposing player in close attendance. It isn't a clear-cut, Swan Lake moment, but looks like a dive, and the referee gives the penalty which Sako duly dispatches. Replays show Afobe could've easily stayed on his feet, but has opted to drop, as he knows it'll earn a penalty. Wolves grab their place in the PL for next season.

But... How do we feel about this? Even if normally we can't stand cheating, especially from our own players, how do we feel about the 'greater good' stemming from the moment of simulation? Will we be so offended and honest that we'll boycott the season in the PL because the moment that got us there was a form of cheating/boxing clever? Will we never look at Afobe the same way again and hurl abuse at him from the stands as he scores a hat-trick against Villa p)? Will we shrug and just look forward to the adventure of next season, and how the PL season and oodles of £££ will benefit the club as a whole?

Something to ponder!

Edit: And don't worry, I'm not overthinking this. Just killing time and curious about this spectrum of what people find acceptable in different contexts, etc!

 

[Espresso]

Lets hope Stefan Maierhofer doesn't collapse like a pack of cards in the area on the last day of the season. I'd be interested to see the reaction.

 

[Alan]

Haven't seen it on video so I'm speaking a little hypothetically here. Anyway...

If Dicko has dived for the penalty it is worse than what Forestieri has done to Sako. Red cards can be rescinded and suspensions lifted. Goals and results are set in stone.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

He hasn't dived, so you are okay there Alan.

 

[Alan]

Good to hear. That would have been very disappointing.

 

[Dublin Drummer Wolf]

If Dicko has dived for the penalty it is worse than what Forestieri has done to Sako. Red cards can be rescinded and suspensions lifted. Goals and results are set in stone.

Rubbish. One is blatant cynical cheating and one is gamesmanship. If you dive in the area, you might get a penalty. A penalty is not a guaranteed goal, and a goal does not guarantee a result.

 

[Alan]

Rubbish. One is blatant cynical cheating and one is gamesmanship. If you dive in the area, you might get a penalty. A penalty is not a guaranteed goal, and a goal does not guarantee a result.

Penalties taken in the Prem since its inception have been converted 85% of the time. That's pretty damn good and I'd imagine (though I can't find anything to substantiate) that teams up a man don't take advantage of it via scoring nearly as often.

"Gamesmanship" is a nonsense term invented so people could more easily coincide a disdain for cheating with an unquenchable thirst for success.

 

[Parkins left foot]

Have watched it back a number of times now.

Was it a choreographed dive to win the penalty (i.e. actual cheating) - no
Was there contact - yes, but not very much
Did Dicko take advantage of that fact as he was in the penalty area & had got across the front of the defender - yes
Did the Ref consider that there was enough impediment to give the penalty - clearly yes
Is this anything like the Forestieri incident when even if there was some body contact it was nowhere near his face - not even in the same continent
Will a group of fans ever agree on decisions like this - is the Pope a catholic.
Is this the longest thread on TWF discussing a single incident - can't be bothered to look back & find out
Did this incident settle the game last night - no (you could say that without TK's save they would have been level & this would not be being discussed - they had chances, just didn't take them)

 

[Edgmond Wolf]

I think it is a penalty and more importantly the ref agreed with me ....

3 goals
3 points

Derby next

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

I think it is a penalty and more importantly the ref agreed with me ....

3 goals
3 points

Derby next

Just adjusted the spelling but I agree with you sir.

 

[Wolf Hunting]

Ok. It wasn't a dive, but with Dicko's athletic ability, it was (an almost embarrassing) collapse to earth.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

Possibly correct there Roy. But it was a penalty.

 

[Quirkafleeg]

173 posts... Fair play Mark. Top wumming mucka.

 

[Paul]

I think it was a penalty. There's contact caused by the defender. Of course I wish football was played in the 1990's, as that's the era I enjoyed most, hard tackles were encouraged, minimal contact was ignored.

Oh. you'd have loved the 70's then

 

[Dinowolf]

173 posts... Fair play Mark. Top wumming mucka.

+1

 

[slink]

It's definitely not a penalty. Contact on the ball and minimal if any contact on Nouha who goes to ground far too easily. I think he's dived and while i'm not a fan we won and have 3 points.

 

[Dinowolf]

Everyone's entitled to their opinion.........even if it's wrong.

 

[Paddingtonwolf]

It's definitely not a penalty. Contact on the ball and minimal if any contact on Nouha who goes to ground far too easily. I think he's dived and while i'm not a fan we won and have 3 points.

He never touches the ball that I can see.

 

[slink]

He never touches the ball that I can see.

Right foot touches the ball as he plants it.