Euro 2020

[Tony Towner]

As I've said, Sancho and Rashford have great records from the spot and take them regularly at club level.

Sterling didn't take one, I imagine as he has a terrible record (scored 2/missed 3, and we know it's actually missed 4 because he missed twice in a minute against us at Molineux but it was retaken), who else? Grealish has never taken a penalty in senior football. Nor has Phillips. Are we really saying the deciding factor was John Stones or Luke Shaw not stepping up, because they were the only other outfield players on the pitch. It's a bit desperate for me.

If Grealish and Sterling aren't in your 5 then you sub them off with 5 to go for Rashford and Sancho and let them get a feel of the game. That way you get your penalty takers on and don't lose your shape

 

[AndyWolves]

The players are getting better (I think)

How do we get more english managers to the top of the game?

I don't blame Southgate, he's the best we've got. What is like is more top English managers

 

[Tredman]

Its not lack of English managers at the top imo, its a common theme that international managers are just not very good. Even Mancini was pretty washed up before taking the Italy job. Then you have Deschamps, Di Matteo etc - can't think of one genuinely outstanding manager.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

If Grealish and Sterling aren't in your 5 then you sub them off with 5 to go for Rashford and Sancho and let them get a feel of the game. That way you get your penalty takers on and don't lose your shape

I don't think it would have made a jot of difference to be honest.

If we get a penalty in the first two minutes next season then I'm not going to think "Raul will miss, he's not even had a touch yet".

 

[Tony Towner]

Its not lack of English managers at the top imo, its a common theme that international managers are just not very good. Even Mancini was pretty washed up before taking the Italy job. Then you have Deschamps, Di Matteo etc - can't think of one genuinely outstanding manager.

Comes down to money by and large. Nuno was on twice what Southgate is, so unless you get someone doing the job for the prestige then really you are looking at second tier managers.

 

[Templeton Peck]

Can't think why we didn't throw the kitchen sink at one of the great counterattacking teams while we had the lead, personally.

Yep, cos that's what was being advocated.

 

[WolfMan]

No shades of grey in your world, everything is black and white?

The plan in the second half was to let Italy have the ball and hold shape, that naturally pins you back unless you have a captain/ centre half directing the team to hold a higher line. The lack of natural width other than the full backs and Sterling meant we didn't have an out ball. Defend higher up the pitch and try to have more possession rather than being passive isn't the same as all out attack, just carry on doing what we were mindset wise. Ultimately after the equaliser and the tactical adjustment it was more of a 50/50 game again.

No it's not all black and white, far from it. You can say this was the plan or that was the plan, you've got no idea. You weren't in the dressing room at half time.

When it comes to analysing matches, you state your opinions as fact. It all sounds technical and impressive, but could you stand in front of a team of real footballers and convey what you are saying to them effectively? If you could and everything you are saying makes perfect sense, why aren't you earning millions of pounds as a manager? The implication in your criticism is that if you were in charge last night, with all of your tactical knowledge and analytical ability, we'd have won.

In my nuanced assesment of the facts available to me, I just think that's bullshit.

I'm proper upset about last night, really hungover and miserable so sorry if I'm being overly harsh here.

 

[Tony Towner]

No it's not all black and white, far from it. You can say this was the plan or that was the plan, you've got no idea. You weren't in the dressing room at half time.

When it comes to analysing matches, you state your opinions as fact. It all sounds technical and impressive, but could you stand in front of a team of real footballers and convey what you are saying to them effectively? If you could and everything you are saying makes perfect sense, why aren't you earning millions of pounds as a manager? The implication in your criticism is that if you were in charge last night, with all of your tactical knowledge and analytical ability, we'd have won.

In my nuanced assesment of the facts available to me, I just think that's bullshit.

I'm proper upset about last night, really hungover and miserable so sorry if I'm being overly harsh here.

The last paragraph doesn't excuse the pompous shite which precedes is.

 

[AndyWolves]

Its not lack of English managers at the top imo, its a common theme that international managers are just not very good. Even Mancini was pretty washed up before taking the Italy job. Then you have Deschamps, Di Matteo etc - can't think of one genuinely outstanding manager.

Sorry, I didn't really expand on what I meant. A lack of English managers at the top of the game suggests to me that our tactical / management skills, as a nation, or at least applying those skills to be able to produce managers who are good enough is lacking.

Could possibly point to a deeper issue that we don't have environments to developing the right kind of thinking around football if you catch my drift.

 

[jlo]

If Grealish and Sterling aren't in your 5 then you sub them off with 5 to go for Rashford and Sancho and let them get a feel of the game. That way you get your penalty takers on and don't lose your shape

I'd still rather Sterling and Grealish took penalties over Walker and Henderson though, that's the point. I think some of the players were just on last legs but the danger of scoring early was we wouldn't push on, that's where the error lies in my view that we didn't try to get a second quickly (but who can blame them, they equally didn't want to throw a lead away)

 

[WolfMan]

The last paragraph doesn't excuse the pompous shite which precedes is.

You are probably right to be honest and I am sorry, that's what football forums are for after all isn't it, discussing tactics etc.

I do think it had less to do with tactics last night and more to do with quality though. Just think their midfield is better at passing than ours so it was always going to be an uphill struggle once they got into a rythm.

 

[Throbber3]

I try to be realistic
Unbeaten in the tournament with 5 wins and two draws, the best record.
Beat the Croatians who beat us in the semi.
Beat the Germans who we don’t beat in k o football , since forever.
Beat Ukraine who we didn’t beat in the last two matches against them
Beat Denmark who were unbeaten against us in the nations league
Lost to Italy on a 33 match unbeaten run thanks to two saves from a colossus goalkeeper who is likely to be the best in the world for the next 15 years.

Showed amazing unity throughout the tournament led by a manager who will play it his way. He got it wrong yesterday but not by much. I am not a fan of his handbrake on approach but you cannot deny it brings results, much like a certain well respected and much love ex wolves manager. Onwards and upwards. Let’s show the racist bastards how much love and respect we have for all the BAME footballers who represent our nation and who play the professional game world wide. There is no place in sport for such bigotry.

 

[sycophantia]

I'd still rather Sterling and Grealish took penalties over Walker and Henderson though, that's the point. I think some of the players were just on last legs but the danger of scoring early was we wouldn't push on, that's where the error lies in my view that we didn't try to get a second quickly (but who can blame them, they equally didn't want to throw a lead away)

I think we did try and get a second, all over them for 15-20 minutes, Italy got some sort of control after that but we still created a number of attacking threats on the break, just couldn't get that second. We had Italy's defence on toast for a bit but they're are superb defenders and managed to get back to what they do best.

 

[Haggstone]

They were better than us because they are a better team than us. Yes we have more/better attacking players but they have a more even distribution of talent throughout the team where as we are a little top heavy. That’s why they took control of the game and why we couldn’t do anything to stop it.

 

[Alan]

England are stacked up top and serviceable enough to win at the back, but that Phillips + Rice combo is just not good enough right now to take the game to the opposition. Phillips especially was mostly a passenger for the entire second half. Ran himself ragged in the first half, and fair play, but his influence on things from about the 55th onward was null.

There are no other English midfielders who could do that job? Somehow I doubt it.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Not really, we're very light. Henderson is getting on a bit, wasn't properly fit for this tournament either and his impact going forwards has always been limited. JWP can take set pieces but isn't a very good footballer. Bellingham will be the real deal but this was a cycle too early for him realistically. Mount can play CM in a three but not in a two. Loftus-Cheek has gone right off the radar, was shite for Fulham last season. Dele Alli has forgotten how to play football. No-one else is particularly close off the top of my head.

 

[WolfMan]

Not really, we're very light. Henderson is getting on a bit, wasn't properly fit for this tournament either and his impact going forwards has always been limited. JWP can take set pieces but isn't a very good footballer. Bellingham will be the real deal but this was a cycle too early for him realistically. Mount can play CM in a three but not in a two. Loftus-Cheek has gone right off the radar, was shite for Fulham last season. Dele Alli has forgotten how to play football. No-one else is particularly close off the top of my head.

Ward-Prowse maybe? Great set piece delivery as well. Can't say I've really watched him that much but Southampton fans seem to love him.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Mentioned him, right there

He isn't very good at all in open play. Runs like an old woman chasing after a bus.

 

[WolfMan]

Mentioned him, right there

He isn't very good at all in open play. Runs like an old woman chasing after a bus.

 

[The Bear]

I don't think it would have made a jot of difference to be honest.

If we get a penalty in the first two minutes next season then I'm not going to think "Raul will miss, he's not even had a touch yet".

That's a bit different to being young lads like Sancho and Saka coming off the bench straight into an international final penalty shootout, and the biggest England game since 1966. Massive pressure situation to have the entire country's hopes on your shoulders at that age with no experience of big international games like that before.