Wolves 1-0 Reading: The Verdict

[Deutsch Wolf]

I think the 5 profesional league managers who have continuously chosen him, says all that is needed to be said.

Consider me told, Terry Connor and Dean Saunders know best.

I'm confused, you don't mind people having an opinion so long as they aren't having a go at the players pre-match? Should I hold my opinion that Matt Doherty is appalling up to 1.59pm on Monday then from 2-5pm abandon that because the manager has decided that picking him is a good idea?

Presumably no fans should ever demand that a manager be sacked then, as they couldn't possibly do a better job themselves, they don't know what they're on about. Regardless of results and obvious errors. But this doesn't extend to slating the owner of the club, you don't need to have owned a club to have a go at them. Which is convenient.

 

[Dinowolf]

Sadly, I find the negativity on here so typical of today's football fans. No we are not a particularly good team at the moment, and yes we were a little fortunate this evening. I get the impression that it does not matter what certain players do, they will be regarded as not good enough. And our head coach is slated for not picking the team that this forum demands.

Personally, I am delighted we won. I just find it disappointing that not all fans of our wonderful club think likewise.

Agree with this 100%.

 

[thehistorymakers]

Consider me told, Terry Connor and Dean Saunders know best.

.

Do you really think you know more about football coaching and tactics than they do?

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Sadly, I find the negativity on here so typical of today's football fans. No we are not a particularly good team at the moment, and yes we were a little fortunate this evening. I get the impression that it does not matter what certain players do, they will be regarded as not good enough. And our head coach is slated for not picking the team that this forum demands.

Personally, I am delighted we won. I just find it disappointing that not all fans of our wonderful club think likewise.

In the current circumstances I'll take three points however they come. To pretend that everything is alright because we somehow did pick up a win would be the height of myopia though.

Man Utd were top of the league about six weeks ago, it would have been folly on the part of their supporters to think that everything was alright because of their very generous league position. It was quite obvious that the football they were playing was terrible and now they have results balancing back out against them. Football is not as binary as we win = everything is great.

As for the current players, there are a clutch of them that quite obviously are not good enough for where we want to be in this division, let alone any higher, and never will be. I can't change that opinion, formed out of having watched them at length for years, just because our current manager thinks it's a good idea to persevere with them against all logic and reason.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Do you really think you know more about football coaching and tactics than they do?

It's a facile argument, because even if I said I did you're not going to agree. I do think I know enough about football to say that Dean Saunders is a halfwit who has very little clue about management. That's why he keeps relegating teams and getting the sack.

I do hope you've never sent a meal back in a restaurant, not being possessed of any Michelin stars of your own.

 

[thehistorymakers]

But this doesn't extend to slating the owner of the club, you don't need to have owned a club to have a go at them. Which is convenient.

I was slated when I posted about the stupidity of selling our most experienced defender, at the end of the summer transfer deadline. This when DB was injured. This was clearly done to release funds to cover another position. I said at the time that there was a lack of investment and ambitiion. Some of the same posters who slag our manager off and certain players, week in week out defended our investment and were happy with our squad and our owner Steve Morgan.
I said at the time, that something was wrong and didn't make sense. It was, Morgan wanted out.

 

[thehistorymakers]

It's a facile argument, because even if I said I did you're not going to agree.

I would be worried if you really believed you are a better manager or coach than any profesional league manager.
Saunders was joint top of div 1, when Doncaster gave Wolves permission to talk to him.
Obviously Wolves were too much for him, but they would have been too much for many managers at the time.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

I didn't say I was.

I think I'm done with responding to your half answers, you aren't really interested in having a discussion. I think I'll keep having my opinions without being bound by your parameters of when I can and can't say that a player is rubbish.

 

[EdgeOfTheAlps]

Yes, but when posters slag players week in week out and our last 5 managers have picked the same players, who do you believe, profesional league managers or posters on a football forum?
I of course agree with peoples right to express their opinions, but the hatred shown to a few of our players before they have kicked a ball, is taking it too far.

How many other players go from PL regular to League One without at least one club, either newly promoted or relegated, sniffing around? Edwards hasn't even attracted the attention of the manager's for whom he was an ever present.

 

[Tony Towner]

I was slated when I posted about the stupidity of selling our most experienced defender, at the end of the summer transfer deadline. This when DB was injured. This was clearly done to release funds to cover another position. I said at the time that there was a lack of investment and ambitiion. Some of the same posters who slag our manager off and certain players, week in week out defended our investment and were happy with our squad and our owner Steve Morgan.
I said at the time, that something was wrong and didn't make sense. It was, Morgan wanted out.

I cannot remember whether you were or you weren't, but at least 50% of this board, me included, thought it was a shit decision and probably not even Jackett's

The tone of some of the older posters that in the old days we all got behind all the players is such total twaddle. I've read numerous pieces in the past detailing how players in the 60's and 70's were hammered by fans, but their revisionist haze seems to forget this. The only difference now is the immediacy of message boards versus whether you could be arsed to write into the Sporting Star that may or may not print your letter in a weeks time.

One for Frank from the dark days, Campbell Chapman, was got on the back ,by a large proportion of our dwindling number of fans because he was seen as in the team because his dad was the manager

 

[thehistorymakers]

Edwards hasn't even attracted the attention of the manager's for whom he was an ever present.

The point surely is, they regularly chose him, when they were his manager!

 

[Johnny75]

I would be worried if you really believed you are a better manager or coach than any profesional league manager.
Saunders was joint top of div 1, when Doncaster gave Wolves permission to talk to him.
Obviously Wolves were too much for him, but they would have been too much for many managers at the time.

By that logic, you will never disagree with any player assessment or team assessment I make as I was a professional football scout?

And I also expect your support on everything recruitment in football.

Of course if you knew anything about football you would know questioning decisions, opinions and tactics is very important. The level of education, position and experience counts, and it is also recognised that sycophants are detrimental to any situation.

 

[thehistorymakers]

I didn't say I was.

I think I'm done with responding to your half answers, you aren't really interested in having a discussion. I think I'll keep having my opinions without being bound by your parameters of when I can and can't say that a player is rubbish.

Feel free. You moan about the same players every week. Surely I can point that out?

 

[thehistorymakers]

By that logic, you will never disagree with any player assessment or team assessment I make as I was a professional football scout?

I could disagree, but I wouldn't say say I know better week in week out than a profesional league manager. If a manager has got a team promoted 2 or 3 times, or to the top of div 1, surely he knows better than me?
As for recruitment, I am sure I read in one of your posts that KT was responsible for our bad recruitment?

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

If you like. I have a go at them because they turn in terrible performance after terrible performance. Like I say - I don't think Edwards has had a single shot on goal in the last four home games. I'm not sure he had a shot vs Burnley at home either, so make it five. For someone playing in that position, that is completely indefensible. That's why I have a go at him, he doesn't do anything that's required of someone playing in such an advanced and pivotal role. It's an opinion based on footballing grounds, not that I just blindly dislike the bloke. I don't really care if the manager keeps picking him (well I do care, but it doesn't impact on what I think of Dave Edwards), that's my opinion. Always open to discuss whether I am right or wrong. That being the nature of a forum and all.

If you do fancy getting into a discussion any time in future, you're going to need to do better than "the manager knows best" and selective answering of questions. Otherwise it isn't much of a discussion.

 

[Johnny75]

I could disagree, but I wouldn't say say I know better week in week out than a profesional league manger. If a manager has got a team promoted 2 or 3 times, or to the top of div 1, surely he knows better than me?
As for recruitment, I am sure I read in one of your posts that KT was responsible for our bad recruitment?

So you would say that I know better than you on player, team and tactical assessments, having done it professionally?

And you would say I have infinitely more knowledge than you on all matters football, having coached and scouted at semi-pro and professional level respectively?

I'll also educate you; it is a professional scouts job when completing a team assessment to match your team against the team you have just watched and explain how you would exploit perceived strengths and weaknesses.

My point being that although this comes across as arrogant it is also incredibly wrong. Everybody's opinion should be respected no matter how batshit they are. Whether you think that right or wrong is up to you and as long as the arguments are reasoned then those opinions should be listened to.

 

[thehistorymakers]

So you would say that I know better than you on player, team and tactical assessments, having done it professionally?

And you would say I have infinitely more knowledge than you on all matters football, having coached and scouted at semi-pro and professional level respectively?

I'll also educate you; it is a professional scouts job when completing a team assessment to match your team against the team you have just watched and explain how you would exploit perceived strengths and weaknesses.

My point being that although this comes across as arrogant it is also incredibly wrong. Everybody's opinion should be respected no matter how bat$#@! they are. Whether you think that right or wrong is up to you and as long as the arguments are reasoned then those opinions should be listened to.

You have no idea about my football credentials. I have no idea about yours. I would never asume I know more than another person, or less, on a football forum. Never state you know more about something, than someone you don't know anything about.
I stand by my statement, that our last 5 managers know more about football coaching than the posters, who slag players off.
If you read the Wolves/Reading build up thread, before a ball was even kicked, the same nasty weekly personal slagging off our players, by the same posters was prevelant. You would be hard pushed to find so much slagging off of our players on an albion forum. Of course people can have opinions, like I can have an opinion about the same slagging off of certain players every week.
You aren't Glen Hoddle are you, in disguise?

 

[Papper]

Sadly, I find the negativity on here so typical of today's football fans.

I wasn't convinced last season (especially the defence) but it's been a long time since we've had such a puerile/ineffective team. Again, we look a team that is bad enough to go down out of this league and that is rarity for the Wolves. Moxey, Thelwell and Jackett are accountable and the negativity is sadly merited. Most of them we're absolutely knackered mid-way through the second half and the passing and movement was none existent. We didn't try to football ourselves out of the pressure we scrapped, tugged and kicked it back to them. We might as well as put Holt on at HT given how Afobe was treated ..... everything about that team second half (as a unit) stank badly ...

 

[thehistorymakers]

If you like. I have a go at them because they turn in terrible performance after terrible performance. Like I say - I don't think Edwards has had a single shot on goal in the last four home games. I'm not sure he had a shot vs Burnley at home either, so make it five. For someone playing in that position, that is completely indefensible. That's why I have a go at him, he doesn't do anything that's required of someone playing in such an advanced and pivotal role. It's an opinion based on footballing grounds, not that I just blindly dislike the bloke. I don't really care if the manager keeps picking him (well I do care, but it doesn't impact on what I think of Dave Edwards), that's my opinion. Always open to discuss whether I am right or wrong. That being the nature of a forum and all.

If you do fancy getting into a discussion any time in future, you're going to need to do better than "the manager knows best" and selective answering of questions. Otherwise it isn't much of a discussion.

Good points which I respect. But couldn't we at least look for positive things on the build up thread? Not over the top, just a few positive things.There must be a few we could find. We have the same players being critisized weekly, even before they kick the ball. Edwards is not the most skilful player, of course not. He is veratile and plays where he is put. He isn't our best player, but gives 100%. I prefer this, to a gifted player, who doesn't make any effort.
I don't think Wolves are playing badly, because of Edwards, I think it has more to do with those who can play better, not playing to their potential.
One thing for sure, we are always an unbalanced side. We play players out of position, often to do with the lack of back up in a given position. It is easy to blame Kenny, but there have to be serious questions to our recruitment policy and who is deciding which player we buy and sell.

 

[Papper]

One thing for sure, we are always an unbalanced side. We play players out of position, often to do with the lack of back up in a given position. It is easy to blame Kenny, but there have to be serious questions to our recruitment policy and who is deciding which player we buy and sell.

Apart from Doherty (and that's debatable) that was as 'in their positions' and 'balanced as it gets'. Edwards is fine further forward behind two strikers. Edwards is the least of our worries. Our defence is very bad ... as bad as I can remember.