Wolves 0-1 Liverpool: Verdict Thread

[YoungWolf]

I don't think this is the great vindicating statement people think it is.

It doesn't reflect well on Nuno or the club's decision making that we chose a 'no pre-season' period to start dismantling established personnel and playing style and replacing them with crocks, kids who rarely play and Nelson '1 assist 0 goals' Semedo, and a new 'style' that so far looks less effective and less attractive than the old one

Remember, it's that decision making that people are saying mean we should be optimistic about the huge work we have to undertake in summer 2021

Disagree with your first point (it put us at a serious disadvantage imo - even if we got lucky with some results at the start of the season). It really can't be under-estimated from a physical, technical and tactical point that it really is a big issue to overcome (and we haven't done a great job of that anyway).

Agree with your second.

The young signings we made were clearly not expected to make an immediate impact, and I am enthusiastic about Fabio and Hoever, and will be about Vitinha and RAN if we sign them too. Having them in the building plus making the right signings this summer puts our squad in a really good position in my opinion - but as you rightly said before, it's a leap to back the club to get that 100% right this summer.

We made a big mistake not getting in a replacement for Jota (which would also have helped solve our issue around a back up for Raul too) and left our squad too bottom heavy too. That needs to be addressed.

 

[AndyWolves]

I don't think this is the great vindicating statement people think it is.

It doesn't reflect well on Nuno or the club's decision making that we chose a 'no pre-season' period to start dismantling established personnel and playing style and replacing them with crocks, kids who rarely play and Nelson '1 assist 0 goals' Semedo, and a new 'style' that so far looks less effective and less attractive than the old one

Remember, it's that decision making that people are saying mean we should be optimistic about the huge work we have to undertake in summer 2021

We finished last season playing shite, there was every chance we would take that shitness into this season. At least they recognised that and try to change it, it didn't work but it's better to do something rather than just hoping what worked before will work again.

If our summer was as awful and misguided as you say, then surely Nuno and the team deserve some credit for keeping us out of the relegation battle?

 

[prawnking]

We finished last season playing shite, there was every chance we would take that shitness into this season. At least they recognised that and try to change it, it didn't work but it's better to do something rather than just hoping what worked before will work again.

If our summer was as awful and misguided as you say, then surely Nuno and the team deserve some credit for keeping us out of the relegation battle?

I'm not sure what your position is here.

You seem to be playing down/ignoring their culpability in some muddled/poor decision-making that pre-dates and carries on through this season, but then making a 'clever' point that they should somehow get credit for us not being in WBA or Sheff Utd territory.

Even Nuno's biggest supporters would surely concede that this season raises a lot of questions, especially after three seasons of progress. I don't understand the desire to contort every sinew to make him seem spotless and unblemished. That doesn't help anyone?

 

[Wilf Wolf]

I don't think 4-2-3-1 is the future as I think we look better 3-4-3 or 3-4-1-2 with the players we have, we just need better options in the front 3 and a RCB.

That's only a 2/3 players imo and be like the positive play we had last night as we had more than enough chances to win that game.

I’m inclined to agree. We have more players suited to 3 at the back and going 3-4-1-2 and getting the wingbacks to give width rather than wingers will help us get more bodies in the box when we attack. Jonny has proved he can play the role and if Semedo had options inside rather than feeding Traore and rarely interacting thereafter I think he’d look a lot better.

If Neto was played more centrally he too would have more options and hopefully be less inclined to do too much too often.

 

[Tredman]

I don't think 4-2-3-1 is the future as I think we look better 3-4-3 or 3-4-1-2 with the players we have, we just need better options in the front 3 and a RCB.

That's only a 2/3 players imo and be like the positive play we had last night as we had more than enough chances to win that game.

Absolutely, there's no need to chuck the baby out with the bath water - positive play makes more difference to us regardless of the formation.

 

[Tony Towner]

I don't think we have the players to play 343 in a style that takes the game to the opposition, so to do so we'd still need 3 players - wide forward, mobile CM, RCH.

If we go 352/3412 it's potentially 2 if Neto can be either the 2nd forward or the ACM. I think he'll be better wider though.

On a sidenote I'll be pissed off if we go back to 352 given who we lost by abandoning it

 

[YoungWolf]

I think the plan is to become more flexible, so that we can shift to a back four when we need to commit more players in front of the ball or break teams down, or press higher up the pitch. The academy age groups seem to be doing that at the moment.

I would be trying 4231 for the rest of the season once Podence is fit (or at least I am hopeful Nuno will try it)

 

[Derby Wolf]

And whoever said the forum is more frustrating than last nights game, hell yeah, barely been able to get on the last few weeks. Fed up of clearing my history and being logged out of everything else so I just fuck it off now and read what you lot put. Admin clearly don't care though, fair enough, their site. Inabit.

This site is run by volunteers at their own personal cost so let's show a bit of respect yeah?

Access the forum via Incognito tabs. Works 100/100 for me and you only need to log in on the forum then. Its simple.

 

[Deutsch Wolf]

Saiss

We should have had a penalty in the first-half on Nelson. Even after when we saw the images inside, it was clearly a penalty. I don’t know how they didn’t it. It’s impossible they don’t check that and don’t give the penalty.

“The goalkeeper lost the ball and after it’s like he’s playing rugby. I don’t know, maybe it’s because he’s been watching the Six Nations or if that’s normal, but he lost the ball and then he goes straight into Nelson. It’s clearly a pen.

 

[Johnny75]

I think the plan is to become more flexible, so that we can shift to a back four when we need to commit more players in front of the ball or break teams down, or press higher up the pitch. The academy age groups seem to be doing that at the moment.

I would be trying 4231 for the rest of the season once Podence is fit (or at least I am hopeful Nuno will try it)

Although they were rubbish yesterday against Sunderland.

 

[AndyWolves]

I'm not sure what your position is here.

You seem to be playing down/ignoring their culpability in some muddled/poor decision-making that pre-dates and carries on through this season, but then making a 'clever' point that they should somehow get credit for us not being in WBA or Sheff Utd territory.

Even Nuno's biggest supporters would surely concede that this season raises a lot of questions, especially after three seasons of progress. I don't understand the desire to contort every sinew to make him seem spotless and unblemished. That doesn't help anyone?

My position is that I don't expect perfection and will afford Nuno and his team some credit. My philosophy is that the best thing you can do is make the right decision, the second best thing is the wrong decision and the worst thing is to do nothing.

If they got the summer wrong, and to such an extent as you say, then surely it's only logical to say that keeping us away from a potential relegation scrap (I'm talking about Fulham here and not WBA / Sheff United) whilst having our top scorer out injured for the majority of the season surely deserves some credit?

I don't see how you can have one without the other.

I'm not sure why you think that's "clever", it's just facts right?

 

[Del Woppio]

You're basically saying that somebody that shits themselves but then washes their pants should get credit

 

[YoungWolf]

Although they were rubbish yesterday against Sunderland.

I don't think that has anything to do with what the general plan is though. I only saw the first half tbf, they started OK. We don't have an out and out striker in the U23s who can lead the line, and without Corbeanu they don't have much wide threat as Campbell is still only just back from injury.

 

[prawnking]

My position is that I don't expect perfection and will afford Nuno and his team some credit. My philosophy is that the best thing you can do is make the right decision, the second best thing is the wrong decision and the worst thing is to do nothing.

If they got the summer wrong, and to such an extent as you say, then surely it's only logical to say that keeping us away from a potential relegation scrap (I'm talking about Fulham here and not WBA / Sheff United) whilst having our top scorer out injured for the majority of the season surely deserves some credit?

I don't see how you can have one without the other.

I'm not sure why you think that's "clever", it's just facts right?

If Nuno and the team had us fighting for a top 7 place again I'd be praising him highly.

If we'd done so badly that we were deep in a relegation battle I may even be seriously questioning whether he is the right man to take us forward.

As it is, as we're lower mid-table with lukewarm performances and two questionable transfer windows behind us, I'm just saying this season has raised questions. That seems both fair and proportionate to me.

 

[Deleted Cyber]

I ha

We're not the same side as at the beginning of the season though and if you thought it was the same last night you need to lay off the bourbon.

We were not passive, defensive or horseshoe in shape, we actually had adventure. Semedo had the first shot on target from a good move and we carved open Liverpool at will. We have issues with our front 3 and the make up of the squad and we clearly need a RCB (poor Saiss has no right foot).

We need two players, maybe three but not major surgery.

ve said the same. We looked fine at the back and in the middle. Rancid up top

 

[AndyWolves]

You're basically saying that somebody that shits themselves but then washes their pants should get credit

I'm saying people learn from mistakes.

"A person who never made a mistake never tried anything new"

 

[lemonjelly]

I understand that pre-season is an intense, foundation-building period, and that it's less ideal to be doing that work once the season is underway, so it begs the question what we did last pre-season. Certainly less effective work than the likes of Moyes or Smith!

And I'm not quite convinced by the argument that it's pre-season or bust in terms of team development anyway. Look at the changes Parker at Fulham has made in restructuring his team into a decent unit while the season has been underway. We're almost 30 games in and we're still rocking the ineffective 3-4-3 with the same players. OK, they're sometimes playing a bit higher up the pitch and sometimes pressing higher too, but not that consistently. We've still had five or six months of in-season weekly training sessions, with millimetrical progress as far as I can see?

We have three weeks before our next game, does anyone believe we're going to see any improvements by then?

I agree with YW in that no pre-season seriously hampered us. That isn't a get out of jail free card for club management mind.

However, to argue the bit in bold - a system that no-one on here foresaw, and that took us from 15th in the championship. to championship winners in 1 season, then 2 consecutive 7th place finishes and argue it is ineffective just doesn't follow. We have been an immensely effective football team for the 3 years prior to this season. There have been some awesome games, and some fantastic wins.

 

[MARKakaJIM]

Probably played 352 as much, if not more, since promotion haven't they?

The formation isn't and hasn't ever been the big issue.

 

[AndyWolves]

If Nuno and the team had us fighting for a top 7 place again I'd be praising him highly.

If we'd done so badly that we were deep in a relegation battle I may even be seriously questioning whether he is the right man to take us forward.

As it is, as we're lower mid-table with lukewarm performances and two questionable transfer windows behind us, I'm just saying this season has raised questions. That seems both fair and proportionate to me.

I seem to recall you described last summer in slightly harsher words.

I've said elsewhere I always expected this season to be a bit of an anticlimax. I think even with Jota and the Irish Cafu we wouldn't have been much better, this is just my personal opinion. I also think the window just gone wasn't for this season, but one which will bear fruit in seasons to come.

From a high level view, I don't think we can be too disappointed with our return to the premier league. I'm actually quite excited for next season, 2/3 astute signings in the summer and we'll kick on.

 

[prawnking]

I agree with YW in that no pre-season seriously hampered us. That isn't a get out of jail free card for club management mind.

However, to argue the bit in bold - a system that no-one on here foresaw, and that took us from 15th in the championship. to championship winners in 1 season, then 2 consecutive 7th place finishes and argue it is ineffective just doesn't follow. We have been an immensely effective football team for the 3 years prior to this season. There have been some awesome games, and some fantastic wins.

Of course, I'm talking about playing it this season with different personnel and mentality, and just persevering with it out of caution.